serious question for bears fans

[Ken Gargett]

i promise this is meant seriously and not having a dig. i am genuinely interested. 

if we go back pre draft, the consensus was you guys had done brilliantly in getting the extra picks including the very first pick from Carolina, i think? and that is all true.

the absolute unchallenged consensus also was that Caleb Williams was the star and everyone's choice as No 1. top QB available for years. and so on. i did not see any one challenge that pre draft. so, you guys going with Caleb was no surprise and certainly anything but a reach.

this was relevant to us as we had second pick. seemed a toss of a coin between JD and Maye. everything i read seemed to suggest that Maye was the safer pick and more likely to be the long term franchise QB, although plenty liked JD. watching the highlights, JD seemed so skinny to me that i doubted he could handle the NFL and i did not want a repeat of RG3. which i guess shows why no one asks me for an opinion. 

the only time i saw any suggestion that JD should have gone first was from the Washington coaching staff and Dan Q shortly after the draft when they said that they would have taken JD first. at the time, i (and i suspect everyone else) simply thought they were saying the right things to support our new QB. or perhaps they really are geniuses. but had we had the first pick and gone JD, i reckon the coaching staff would have been at the wrong end of the village pitchforks (before eventually being acknowledged as drafting gods). i did like one description of the pair saying that JD was what Caleb was supposed to be, minus the nail polish and crazy. i have not followed him that closely to know if that is fair. 

obviously Caleb is not a Ryan Leaf and should go on to have a fine career and perhaps an even better one than JD though at the moment, you would not put money on it. no question he is a very fine young QB and as far as i can see, he still has a lot of support. 

i am wondering if any bears fans (or anyone else) has any thoughts? what is the feeling in Chicago? how has the team/admin reacted? where will they end up? just curious. 

of course, with the new coach for Chicago, who knows what that means. 

[Redgoldband]

I’ve had similar thought about this as well. Following this conversation.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Chibearsv]

Let's start with last year's decision to retain Matt Eberflus and hire Shane Waldron as OC.  Every Bears fan knew that retaining Eberflus was a mistake. He was hired as a cheap placeholder which the Bears have always done since no decision is a guarantee of success, so they have always favored risking less money and hoping for a gem in the rocks. Fans were thinking Ryan Poles was behaving differently by seeking out value in player picks and taking advantage of other team's greed. At least that's how his behavior appeared. When he extended Eberflus I thought we were back to the same old Bears - cheapskates.  

Now on to last year's draft. We all knew the Bears were going to draft Williams mostly because he looked like and was talked about like he had potential to be the next Mahomes and after the Trubisky disaster, they couldn't risk missing that magic again. It wouldn't matter if JD looked like an NFL ready QB, they were never going to skip over Caleb. Lots of fans clamored that JD was a better and more "ready to play" choice. It would have been interesting to see if Washington would have agreed to trade up with the Bears if the Bears said they were looking to take JD number one but would be ok with CW at 2. I'd love to know if that poker game was actually played between the 2 GMs, but I doubt the Bears ever even made a phone call to test the waters. I also think Washington was in a pretty sweet spot to have either QB fall into their lap. I don't know if I believe that Quinn coveted JD so much that he would have made a move if the Bears threatened to take JD 1st.

2024 season proved out that the decisions to retain the head coach and to hire Shane Waldron were disasters. An entire waste of a year to help develop CW, and worse, the locker room was a mess since the head coach held nobody accountable for anything. He was busy reading self help and motivational books and asking other coaches how to do his job while his players begged for the coaching staff to "coach them up." Both fired mid-season. The GM should have been tossed out the door too but I suspect that upper management (cheapskates) had a big hand in those decisions and so they really couldn't blame the GM. QB play was predictable according to the noise we heard in the 2024 off season. JD was ready to play in the NFL and Caleb needed guidance and experience which he didn't get. As fans, we were ok with a losing season as long as Caleb got the uplift he was going to need to have NFL success. Instead, disaster season, undisciplined and unmotivated players, no positive growth for Williams except to learn how to get hit.

That takes us to 2025 and where I think we are. The GM was finally let off his leash by upper management to get the coach he wanted. We are hopeful based on our history that Johnson can teach Caleb the skills and the playbook to be a successful NFL QB and can lead a team whose players are begging for discipline and accountability. The new coach, the QB, the GM, and the owner all say the right things right now about how great the future is and how much fans should be excited. It looks like a move in the right direction, but that's this team's M.O., keep hope alive in a city of 6 million people so they buy enough tickets to fill the seats. That's always been the low hanging fruit. The Bears GM, new coach, and QB need to prove that they were ALL the correct choice, or this fan will remain eternally pessimistic. My hope for a playoff appearance within the next 2 years, 15% right now.

Final thoughts on JD if he were a Bear and Caleb a Commander last year...Bears might have won a couple more games and Washington might have lost a couple more. JD certainly looks like the better player by far right now but that wouldn't have overcome the mess that the Bears were and still are until further notice.

[KCCubano]

First order of business should be to improve their O line so Caleb isn't running for his life.

[Chas.Alpha]

4 hours ago, KCCubano said:

First order of business should be to improve their O line so Caleb isn't running for his life.

You beat me to the punch. We all saw what happens to a 14-2 team when the O line collapses. 👿

[Chibearsv]

4 hours ago, KCCubano said:

First order of business should be to improve their O line so Caleb isnt running for his life

 

3 hours ago, Chas.Alpha said:

You beat me to the punch. We all saw what happens to a 14-2 team when the O line collapses. 👿

Oh, we all know what they should do. It's a different matter with this team on what they will do. Younger fans are saying that Johnson is going to do this and going to do that while older fans like me are in "wait and see" mode. I don't believe one word of their collective nonsense anymore. I need to see the team get better - period.

[Ken Gargett]

6 hours ago, Chibearsv said:

Let's start with last year's decision to retain Matt Eberflus and hire Shane Waldron as OC.  Every Bears fan knew that retaining Eberflus was a mistake. He was hired as a cheap placeholder which the Bears have always done since no decision is a guarantee of success, so they have always favored risking less money and hoping for a gem in the rocks. Fans were thinking Ryan Poles was behaving differently by seeking out value in player picks and taking advantage of other team's greed. At least that's how his behavior appeared. When he extended Eberflus I thought we were back to the same old Bears - cheapskates.  

Now on to last year's draft. We all knew the Bears were going to draft Williams mostly because he looked like and was talked about like he had potential to be the next Mahomes and after the Trubisky disaster, they couldn't risk missing that magic again. It wouldn't matter if JD looked like an NFL ready QB, they were never going to skip over Caleb. Lots of fans clamored that JD was a better and more "ready to play" choice. It would have been interesting to see if Washington would have agreed to trade up with the Bears if the Bears said they were looking to take JD number one but would be ok with CW at 2. I'd love to know if that poker game was actually played between the 2 GMs, but I doubt the Bears ever even made a phone call to test the waters. I also think Washington was in a pretty sweet spot to have either QB fall into their lap. I don't know if I believe that Quinn coveted JD so much that he would have made a move if the Bears threatened to take JD 1st.

2024 season proved out that the decisions to retain the head coach and to hire Shane Waldron were disasters. An entire waste of a year to help develop CW, and worse, the locker room was a mess since the head coach held nobody accountable for anything. He was busy reading self help and motivational books and asking other coaches how to do his job while his players begged for the coaching staff to "coach them up." Both fired mid-season. The GM should have been tossed out the door too but I suspect that upper management (cheapskates) had a big hand in those decisions and so they really couldn't blame the GM. QB play was predictable according to the noise we heard in the 2024 off season. JD was ready to play in the NFL and Caleb needed guidance and experience which he didn't get. As fans, we were ok with a losing season as long as Caleb got the uplift he was going to need to have NFL success. Instead, disaster season, undisciplined and unmotivated players, no positive growth for Williams except to learn how to get hit.

That takes us to 2025 and where I think we are. The GM was finally let off his leash by upper management to get the coach he wanted. We are hopeful based on our history that Johnson can teach Caleb the skills and the playbook to be a successful NFL QB and can lead a team whose players are begging for discipline and accountability. The new coach, the QB, the GM, and the owner all say the right things right now about how great the future is and how much fans should be excited. It looks like a move in the right direction, but that's this team's M.O., keep hope alive in a city of 6 million people so they buy enough tickets to fill the seats. That's always been the low hanging fruit. The Bears GM, new coach, and QB need to prove that they were ALL the correct choice, or this fan will remain eternally pessimistic. My hope for a playoff appearance within the next 2 years, 15% right now.

Final thoughts on JD if he were a Bear and Caleb a Commander last year...Bears might have won a couple more games and Washington might have lost a couple more. JD certainly looks like the better player by far right now but that wouldn't have overcome the mess that the Bears were and still are until further notice.

thanks for that. always easier in hindsight of course. interested to hear that many fans were looking at JD. did not pick up on that at the time. 

mind you, but for a ridiculous freak hail mary, caleb beats JD and who knows what momentum that would have caused. plus we probably don't make the playoffs. 

[foursite12]

I agree with most of this. The old Italian expression that "the fish stinks from the head" comes to mind here. While the owners seem to have gotten out of the way on the hire of the new coach (and agreed to write some big checks as part of that), they have historically been hindrances to the team's ultimate performance on the field. Sometimes that has simply been clumsiness; other times the meddling has been more active. I think the addition of Kevin Warren as President two years ago was a significant step in the right direction. By all appearances, Warren and the GM (Ryan Poles) teamed together well to execute the HC replacement process and closure quickly and efficiently while maintaining solid due diligence.  I am, nonetheless, covered with psychological and emotional scars from decades of their abuse. No team can match the Bears' ability to get fans excited in the off-season and then disappoint when the time comes to prove it--not even the Cubs. So yes, I am definitely in the "wait and see mode" mentioned by @Chibearsv. 

I don't feel bad about the Caleb pick versus JD. Caleb suffered through 3 OCs and 2 HCs in his rookie season. He handled it well and proved to be physically and mentally tough, smart, a team player and driven to succeed. He is hardly the diva he was painted to be in the months leading up to the draft. I expect he will grow exponentially moving into the new season. The off-season will be all about Poles doing his GM thing and bringing in some free agents and draftees who can fill some of the obvious holes in the roster.