Hypothetical: New Covid variant & your response next time around.

[El Presidente]

1 hour ago, Namisgr11 said:

Not as huge as you suggest, or as events that you described such as in Colorado can account for in comparison to the all-cause mortality data.

The problem is "trust". It may or may not be statistically relevant, however it plays into the increasing narrative of a political, government and corporate elite that plays very loose with the truth.  

Shocking I know 

[Fuzz]

1 hour ago, El Presidente said:

???

Neither are vaccines

Not sure where you're getting your definition of "vaccine", my good chum.

vaccine

/ˈvaksiːn,ˈvaksɪn/

noun

noun: vaccine; plural noun: vaccines

1. 1.

   a substance used to stimulate immunity to a particular infectious disease or pathogen, typically prepared from an inactivated or weakened form of the causative agent or from its constituents or products.

   "every year the flu vaccine is modified to deal with new strains of the virus"

[El Presidente]

1 minute ago, Fuzz said:

Not sure where you're getting your definition of "vaccine", my good chum.

vaccine

/ˈvaksiːn,ˈvaksɪn/

noun

noun: vaccine; plural noun: vaccines

1. 1.

   a substance used to stimulate immunity to a particular infectious disease or pathogen, typically prepared from an inactivated or weakened form of the causative agent or from its constituents or products.

   "every year the flu vaccine is modified to deal with new strains of the virus"

Mea Culpa  

I incorrectly associate a vaccine to one such as the Polio vaccine where the efficacy is 99% after the full course. 

[Fuzz]

4 minutes ago, El Presidente said:

Mea Culpa  

I incorrectly associate a vaccine to one such as the Polio vaccine where the efficacy is 99% after the full course. 

When you and I got our polio vaccines, they were not that effective, only about 90%. The new course, which is 4 doses, is 99-100%. And oral polio vaccines were discontinued in the 90s due to the very small risk catching polio, as the oral version was a weakened polio virus. The injections use an inactive virus.

The smallpox vaccine was 95% and protection only lasted 3-5 years. Tetanus vaccine needs to be topped up every 10 years to maintain effectiveness.

[MrBirdman]

11 hours ago, Fuzz said:

When you and I got our polio vaccines, they were not that effective, only about 90%. The new course, which is 4 doses, is 99-100%. And oral polio vaccines were discontinued in the 90s due to the very small risk catching polio, as the oral version was a weakened polio virus. The injections use an inactive virus.

The smallpox vaccine was 95% and protection only lasted 3-5 years. Tetanus vaccine needs to be topped up every 10 years to maintain effectiveness.

Exactly. The public’s expectations for what a vaccine should do and reality are part of the problem here. Even chickenpox, the prototypical “one and done” infection/vaccine, benefits from boosting after 65. 

I get the flu vaccine every year even though its efficacy can be as low as 30% in some years. Why? Because 30 is a bigger number than zero. 

[Dozerhead]

As a Healthcare worker, I felt the initial mandates were necessary. They were never political for me. I felt it was imperative to try and reduce the strain on our Healthcare system. Our's was not prepared for what was about to come in Spring of 2020 and quite frankly still hasn't recovered to this day. Staffing shortages, especially RN's, plague hospitals and clinics nationwide and in some areas severely limit their ability to care for all patients.

Thankfully, I don't see us going down that road again with covid, although it will continue to hang around. Thanks to vaccines and natural immunity, the rate of new cases, severe illness and death have dropped significantly from their peaks in 2020 and 2021. 

If something new came along that we weren't ready for, then yes, I would do the whole mask thing again, especially at work. Hopefully, it won't be anytime soon, but regardless, I would still do what I felt was necessary to protect others.

 

 

 

[dominattorney]

On 8/23/2023 at 1:57 PM, Nevrknow said:

Not entirely true. No matter how you died, if you had covid WHEN you died. It counted as a covid death.

Car wreck? Covid.

Bad heart? Covid.

Cancer patient with weeks to live? Covid.

The list is long. Too many taped "info speeches" prove these statements.

I didn't believe this for the longest time. Then I handled a wrongful death cSe where the decedent was ejected from the passenger seat of a car and flew 120 feet into a concrete barrier. Cause of death on the certificate was covid. 

[joeypots]

 Covid 19 was/is real and unexpected and our opinions and feelings about the virus and the response were surely manipulated by people who are clever enough to manipulate the media for no other reason than to create division in our societies. Just like what’s happening in our elections. The first response was clearly ham handed but hind site is 20/20 and in the beginning, around here at least, people were getting very sick and dying. The closer they were packed together the worse it was. My family members in the New York area got it early and bad. My BIL was sick for 9 months with breathing and fatigue issues and had a stroke not too long after he started to feel better. Covid 19 lowered life expectanies world wide, mostly among older people. Young healthy people fared than older people with underlying conditions. As in any herd die off, the weak died first. 

I believe that the forces that worked to deal with Covid 19 did what they thought was the best for the most. The idea that the virus was/is a hoax of some kind or the reaction to it was overblown is in my mind contradicted by the Chinese response. I do not believe the lock down of Shanghai in the spring of ’22 was a cavalier mandate. 

In 1947 people were not so skeptical of vaccines, and they are surely better and safer now than they were 75 years ago. Take a look below at the account of 6 million people being vaccinated in less than a month in NYC after a few cases of small pox emerged in that city. It’s stunning.

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/12/18/nyregion/nyc-smallpox-vaccine.html

[KCCubano]

1 hour ago, dominattorney said:

I didn't believe this for the longest time. Then I handled a wrongful death cSe where the decedent was ejected from the passenger seat of a car and flew 120 feet into a concrete barrier. Cause of death on the certificate was covid. 

Friend of mine died of Fentanyl OD-Cause of death on certificate?? Covid of course! 

[Namisgr11]

The all cause mortality compared with the number of deaths attributed to COVID from March to May, 2020 show that deaths from COVID were undercounted.  The reasons how this can be so are two-fold.  One is that in the early days of the pandemic, the effects of the disease on the lungs and cardiovascular system weren't known, and tens of thousands of COVID fatalities were ascribed to pneumonia, heart attack, and stroke.  So while thousands of deaths may have been inappropriately assigned to COVID, many tens of thousands of deaths due to COVID were incorrectly not assigned to it.  The second is that COVID tests weren't widely and generally available, and so large numbers of COVID deaths could not have been shown to be due to COVID owing to the lack of positive tests.

Just in the first three months of the pandemic in the US, over 120,000 excess deaths occurred but only 90,000 were ascribed to COVID: https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/32609310/

For the year 2020 as a whole, and as pointed out already, there were 600,000 excess deaths in the US.  They occurred without significant changes in the death rates from any of the leading causes of death prior to 2020, and their weekly breakdowns over the course of 2020 show the excess deaths tracked closely in time with the surges in COVID fatalities, such as the March to May period.  The numbers of excess deaths from any cause are from body bag and death certificate counts, and so extremely reliable.  So if you want to believe these 600,000 deaths in 2020 weren't from COVID, you need to come up with an alternative explanation for them, with no other leading cause of death being an eligible alternative.