CA's Unboxing of Cohiba 55 - Counterfeit Box?

[MossybackR]

2 hours ago, mprach024 said:

Poor guy has to drink the swill that is current release vintages now and smoke cigars people actually buy.  Poor guy.

Just like most of us shmucks 😏

[Cigar Salute]

Simple quality control issues?  That looks nothing like the UAO stamp, or ANY stamp Habanos uses.  It actually lines up nicely with some fake reservas that were going around a while ago.  And if it was rolled/boxed at the El Laguito factory, where they were using the MAR stamp daily for 2 years already, how could the person responsible for stamping these boxes NOT catch that?  That's just too much of a reach for me personally.  Even if the cigars are somehow legitimate, CA still should have noticed it and addressed it in the video.  A platform of their size and influence could go a long way in clearing up confusion about an issue like this...But they didn't notice.  It doesn't sound like a big deal to some, but if people saw the quality of some of the counterfeits circulating today... Sometimes a serial number or factory code is your only obvious tell that something isn't right.  If errors like this become treated as acceptable, this is making a bad situation worse.  A popular grey market retailer was recently outed for selling high quality fakes that have been going around for a while now.  Some other reputable dealers have Novedosos available on their site, meanwhile, everyone asked about this cigar has said they werent released.  Truly crazy times and mistakes like this should not be accepted as normal or forgivable; that's just making things so easy for dishonest individuals to do what they do

[NSXCIGAR]

Yeah, I'm really going to need some hard evidence that that code is legit. I find it very hard to believe that Phoenicia is putting these out with those code stickers. The UAO alone makes zero sense. That hasn't been the El Laguito code since what, 2019? 

I would stay far away from these until Phoenicia puts out a statement addressing it. 

8 hours ago, Bijan said:

anyone who actually smokes the cigars will know pretty quick their money went down the drain.

Once you're smoking it you bought it. I doubt the purveyors of fakes are concerned about refunds and/or repeat customers. 

7 hours ago, cigarsdelcuba said:

Guys this is just a simple quality control issue on the part of Habanos...we have seen issues like this thousands of times over and over...

I haven't ever seen anything like this. A years out of sequence factory code and totally wrong code font? Never.

The 4/5 EL bands missing the "premier" is definitely in the spectrum of Cuba being Cuba. The code sticker--no way. 

[Fugu]

Seems a few too many trolls trolling this thread. That box is fake. And - how did someone put it so nicely in another thread?... - I’ll die on this hill.

And shouldn’t all those “many QC-issue” boxes be fakes, they are made for the bin. Worthless to any serious buyer/collector. Plus Habanos had killed that little there still was of its reputation. 

Either way - Habanos seems to have a problem.

[Bijan]

7 hours ago, NSXCIGAR said:

Once you're smoking it you bought it. I doubt the purveyors of fakes are concerned about refunds and/or repeat customers. 

Yes exactly but that's why they sell them on beaches and in alleyways. I mean we all know that you can buy fakes online but we also know the half dozen or dozen legitimate online vendors and if any of them sells fakes they'll poison their business.

[BrightonCorgi]

With wine ratings, read how he describes the wine, not so much the score.  Leave the score out and put the producer and description together as its own thing.  Align his or her reviews to wines you are a familiar with and you can deduce much from how you differ or agree on the same wine.

[Bijan]

9 hours ago, NSXCIGAR said:

The 4/5 EL bands missing the "premier" is definitely in the spectrum of Cuba being Cuba. The code sticker--no way. 

The 4/5 EL bands missing the "premier" is more likely with Cuba being Cuba than counterfeiters. (counterfeiters generally don't mess up features that someone who doesn't know anything about cigars or CCs would notice. In this case 1 of the cigars has a different band).

The weird stamp code font and "invalid" factory code points to counterfeiters. (Counterfeiters generally mess this stuff up, because people who don't know about CCs will not notice).

But nothing bars Habanos from re-using an old factory code or using a weird stamp font. (That is maybe it's random factory UAO, and not El Laguito UAO).

All that being said, I might have said fake based on the stamp, but based on the 4/5 bands and the fact that people are saying the weird stamp is in widespread distribution, I'm not so sure.

[SCgarman]

48 minutes ago, Bijan said:

The 4/5 EL bands missing the "premier" is more likely with Cuba being Cuba than counterfeiters. (counterfeiters generally don't mess up features that someone who doesn't know anything about cigars or CCs would notice. In this case 1 of the cigars has a different band).

The weird stamp code font and "invalid" factory code points to counterfeiters. (Counterfeiters generally mess this stuff up, because people who don't know about CCs will not notice).

But nothing bars Habanos from re-using an old factory code or using a weird stamp font. (That is maybe it's random factory UAO, and not El Laguito UAO).

All that being said, I might have said fake based on the stamp, but based on the 4/5 bands and the fact that people are saying the weird stamp is in widespread distribution, I'm not so sure.

With Cohiba being the flagship brand, and with these sticks being $300/piece, how does a mis-match of bands on the cigars get past any QC? And CA magazine and the powers that be there certainly aren't infallible by any means.

[Bijan]

30 minutes ago, SCgarman said:

With Cohiba being the flagship brand, and with these sticks being $300/piece, how does a mis-match of bands on the cigars get past any QC? And CA magazine and the powers that be there certainly aren't infallible by any means.

The workers are likely still paid peanuts and everyone is probably reluctant to stop production due to lack of the proper bands.

This is a thread for a SLR ER they shipped with Upmann bands:

Edit: One can hope that CA magazine would catch this one in review 

[KCCubano]

All pretty simple to me.. the proof is in the pudding! When CA does a tasting they should know within a few minutes whether its a fake or not. Just my opinion. I have several boxes in my cabinet that came with no box codes and I got once got an 07 box with the SVF code that hadnt been seen since 05. This was from a non grey market reputable vender. Tasted great! 

[BrightonCorgi]

1 hour ago, KCCubano said:

All pretty simple to me.. the proof is in the pudding! When CA does a tasting they should know within a few minutes whether its a fake or not. Just my opinion.

Bingo.  If they cannot tell the difference; what's point of it all.

[Arabian]

David Savona replied back by saying it’s a simple factory error (aka Cuba being Cuba). 

[LizardGizmo]

3 minutes ago, Arabian said:

David Savona replied back by saying it’s a simple factory error (aka Cuba being Cuba). 

I just saw this as well - this is an absurd amount of "oops" for a God-tier Habanos release for Phonecia to simply blame on incompetency. We're talking $300 cigars here...!

[Carrie Nation]

On 9/12/2022 at 2:18 AM, bambambam said:

https://www.cigaraficionado.com/article/video-unboxing-cuba-s-cohiba-55-aniversario-edicion-limitada?fbclid=IwAR3kRbcYxj3Y1XJ5aYrikBUqGXJMf6hHlQQyb2PBI1ruwtCpwf7hE5K__r8

Check out this unboxing video David Savona did for Cigar Aficianado of the Cohiba 55 Limitada

Issues I see:

1. UAO NOV 21? UAO hasn't been used since 2019. The code should be MAR for NOV 21 (and in 2022, El Laguito is GES).
2. The typeface of the box code and the spacing seems way off.
3. One of the EL bands in the box in the video is inconsistent with the other 4, to the point there's an added line that says "premier".

Did CA get duped? I very much think so.

The only "oops" was a few non-Premier bands. The box codes are legit. Like I said, these exact stamps have been showing up in duty-free for awhile. Time to to put away the pitchforks, nooses, and torches.

[99call]

Oh Cohiba!....how I enjoy, not enjoying you.      The original poisoned chalice.  A mountain of hurt. 

 

[SCgarman]

30 minutes ago, bambambam said:

I just saw this as well - this is an absurd amount of "oops" for a God-tier Habanos release for Phonecia to simply blame on incompetency. We're talking $300 cigars here...!

I have to agree. If HSA can't get their finest "artisans" to make sure these top tier cigars are "perfect", then they truly are the clown show they claim not to be. Completely delusional flunkies. 

[Corylax18]

20 minutes ago, Carrie Nation said:

lThe only "oops" was a few non-Premier bands. The box codes are legit. Like I said, these exact stamps have been showing up in duty-free for awhile. Time to to put away the pitchforks, nooses, and torches.

I haven't seen a single case of this code being reused anywhere else recently. Can you include some photos or verification of some sort? 

The Premier bands where supposedly only for a hand full of boxes, in a separate packing type. You're saying they just happened to order a few hundred/thousand extra "premier" bands and they where just floating around El Laguito, along with a stamp from nearly 2 cycles ago? 

It all completely defies logic, of any kind. I also dont think its a coincidence that Phoenician is some how wrapped up in this. They've been flat out B.S.ing people for years on their regionals, so who knows the real story on the "premier" banded cigars. I agree with @99call, Im so glad I'm not afflicted with any desire to spend money on these things. Its just comical at this point. 

[Bigkahuna]

If I go to a 300$ 3 star Michelin restaurant, the meal is flawless. Absolutely flawless. Impeccable timing, preparation and hardware. If I buy an Opus 25th box at 10k it’s 100% flawless. If I buy a 300$ cohiba flagship I need to anticipate things that make question it’s legitimacy? So much that random odd things are inserted ? Let’s be very honest, if these are real then they all need returned and destroyed 

More fake boxes come out of China now than any other place. It’s highly likely that they are fake. There have been recent reports from FB groups of blatent fakes from well known greys. Ones that have been around for many years. Full out fakes.  Where there is smoke, there are fake Cohibas.  😆

[El Presidente]

Deep breath people. So much hate.  Come-on, breathe. 

So what do we actually know. 

1. Habanos are incompetent. 

2. Tabacuba are incompetent. 

3. FB groups are perhaps not the best place to get "gospel" 

Try to avoid slandering organisations as that won't be tolerated. In relation to points 1 and 2 above, "truth" is legally deemed a defence in defamation  actions. 

 

[Bigkahuna]

5 minutes ago, El Presidente said:

 

3. FB groups are perhaps not the best place to get "gospel" 

 

Oh 100% agree. But there are now multiple documented instances with invoices and near perfect boxes (all cohiba) from late 2020 but a funky serial of 000042xxxxxx. I won’t make any conclusions to them being complicit or just unaware but they are increasing in numbers. These kind of mistakes with this 5 set box is concerning at least for me. To be clear, I’m not a buyer 😆 but would hate to see this trash Habanos anymore than what is currently going on. Lol !

 

let’s all pray for the big revolution so that they can catch up to the 21st century and improve standards of living (and tobacco). 

[99call]

13 minutes ago, Corylax18 said:

I agree with @99call, Im so glad I'm not afflicted with any desire to spend money on these things. Its just comical at this point. 

to me peoples aspiration to 'find the best Cuban cigar' is much better served by;

• inspecting cigars in person
• developing good relationships with respectable & trustworthy retailers
• opening up to the fact that money spent is not a guarantee of quality 
• experiencing as broad array of cigars as possible. 

no doubt...if you enjoy the blend,  Cohiba it's as capable as any other brands of showing a bit of stardust.   but thats the problem. A good Coro is no better than a good JL2, just different, and within that.  the fan's sort of cant help but feel a little shortchanged.     If they were genuinely a completely different standard I would totally get it. but unfortunately the bitter pill Cohiba fans have to swallow is:

• It's no guarantee of better quality/performance
• it's an increased risk of being swindled. 

Cohiba will always sell out like hot cakes, and I have no problem with that,  my only sustaining emotion is, is their fans deserve better

[El Presidente]

1 minute ago, Bigkahuna said:

Oh 100% agree. But there are now multiple documented instances with invoices and near perfect boxes (all cohiba) from late 2020 but a funky serial of 000042xxxxxx. I won’t make any conclusions to them being complicit or just unaware but they are increasing in numbers. These kind of mistakes with this 5 set box is concerning at least for me. To be clear, I’m not a buyer 😆 but would hate to see this trash Habanos anymore than what is currently going on. Lol !

 

let’s all pray for the big revolution so that they can catch up to the 21st century and improve standards of living (and tobacco). 

Oh....I don't care about Habanos. 

I do care about vendors being unfairly tarnished. 

I have perfectly legit boxes with 9999 9999 9999 9999 microprinting. According to the some keyboard professionals they are fake.  No they are not. They are the result of a lack of QC.  I am lucky as I detailed them on here.

It is one hell of a mess out there. They need to get their QC right on Cohiba or they will end up with more than  egg on their face. 

 

[mbflash80]

48 minutes ago, Corylax18 said:

I also dont think its a coincidence that Phoenician is some how wrapped up in this. They've been flat out B.S.ing people for years on their regionals, 

Not to take this thread in an unintended direction, but I would love a little more color on this...are we talking about how they made claims about exclusive leaf or about exclusive factories being used? I have really enjoyed most of the regional releases from Phoenicia so this is of interest to me.  Best, MB

[Corylax18]

Just now, mbflash80 said:

Not to take this thread in an unintended direction, but I would love a little more color on this...are we talking about how they made claims about exclusive leaf or about exclusive factories being used? I have really enjoyed most of the regional releases from Phoenicia so this is of interest to me.  Best, MB

That's exactly what I'm talking about. There are other threads discussing both the 30th and 40th in detail, but having a leaflet stating every cigar in the run was rolled at X factory isn't a good look when the cigars are released with at least 3 different box codes. Again, the "explanation" completely defied all logic. Its just BS layered on top of more BS at this point. 

At least for this run they just added some stupid band and changed the count. They apparently didn't feel the need to attach some half cocked backstory that can easily be disproven.  

[NSXCIGAR]

7 hours ago, Bijan said:

I mean we all know that you can buy fakes online but we also know the half dozen or dozen legitimate online vendors and if any of them sells fakes they'll poison their business.

Almost all of the vendors that would sell fakes are not trusted vendors or fly-by-nighters. Trusted vendors are trusted. I'm not worried about them. There are multiple sites selling 04 Cohiba Sublimes and 1966 at great prices...same ones that have been there for years. 

The antidote to fakes is and always will be trusted vendors. Few buy their cigars in person anymore anyway so trusted vendors have been essential for a long time regardless.

1 hour ago, Arabian said:

David Savona replied back by saying it’s a simple factory error (aka Cuba being Cuba). 

Doesn't explain the font, and besides, how would he know? 

14 minutes ago, El Presidente said:

I have perfectly legit boxes with 9999 9999 9999 9999 microprinting. According to the some keyboard professionals they are fake.  No they are not. They are the result of a lack of QC.  I am lucky as I detailed them on here

An (apparently) isolated incident fully documented by a highly trusted vendor. I think that's what we're looking for with this code sticker issue. There aren't many trusted vendors in that region so it's going to have to be DF Beirut or Phoenicia themselves that needs to address this.

1 hour ago, bambambam said:

I just saw this as well - this is an absurd amount of "oops" for a God-tier Habanos release for Phonecia to simply blame on incompetency. We're talking $300 cigars here...!

I don't think it's outside the realm of possibility that these 5-boxes were packed by Phoenicia. They are special for them and may have been sent separately from the cigars to Phoenicia. I doubt the HSA general release packaging is even close to being ready on these yet so again it's quite reasonable to assume the cigars and the 5-boxes were acquired by Phoenicia separately. If that's the case it's also possible Phoenicia printed and applied the code stickers with the odd font and wrong UAO code. Fine, but they need to address that. 

There were also the sample 2-packs handed out at the launch parties that did not have the "premier" bands. It is very likely both versions were comingled at Phoenicia at some point. It is a very easy thing to miss on those bands. At first glance I missed it as well. 

The bottom line is that someone--probably Phoenicia--needs to comment on this. These are their specialized products.