Are Price increases affecting your enjoyment?

[Bijan]

3 minutes ago, jakebarnes said:

I guess I find it a little odd that there comes an existential dread to enjoying a luxury leisure product.

Depends on how much you like the product/hobby and your financial means. And your stage in life and your supply.

For some this price trend means cutting way back or finding another hobby.

Maybe not existential dread, but not happy thoughts.

[jakebarnes]

4 minutes ago, Bijan said:

Depends on how much you like the product/hobby and your financial means. And your stage in life and your supply.

For some this price trend means cutting way back or finding another hobby.

Maybe not existential dread, but not happy thoughts.

Great angle on that. That's definitely one of the parts I am missing here. I had debated putting in "at my given consumption pace, I probably have what I need already for life and then more" but had left it out. I think that's definitely a missing input in the equation that I should have looked at more. 

[foursite12]

2 hours ago, Ford2112 said:

I smoked a Reyes the other day and savored every second of it,,whereas before I might not have paid as much attention. I think I enjoyed it more due to the fact I only have a limited supply of Trinidads and Cohiba and likely will buy very few more at these prices. As for consumption I will continue to smoke like a chimney.

Exactly. Well said.

[djrey]

Addressing enjoyment of cigars in the current climate is two pronged for me. One part of me realizes that I have 8 years of stock if I am careful and I should live in the moment and enjoy my smokes. Then there is the other side that has always enjoyed reading about new (to me) brands and vitolas that I haven't tried yet and getting excited about the new crops and vintages etc. All that is gone. Why read a review on a Cohiba or Trinidad anything? I'll never smoke one.

Even something like the humble D4. Unless something drastic changes I will never buy another box again. I have what I have and once its gone its gone. That to me is very depressing and I cant help but think about it every time I light one. There are many brands and vitolas that I never got to and likely never will at this point. And there will be no excitement of landing my first box on 24:24 and waiting for its arrival and the first time ever lighting one up. All that kid on Christmas feeling is gone.  So my whole enjoyment of reading and learning about brands, reviews and any future industry news has been effectively taken from me. 

I am brining some NC stock back into my CC rotation but it sucks because I simply do not enjoy the majority of them anymore, so I often feel like I am smoking something just to smoke. Its overall a depressing time. I am pretty much at HUHC only budget at this point while trying to stretch my larger format collection.

As a few mentioned above I am hoping to develop more appreciation for the smokes I do have and enjoy every single second.  

[Puro_Lover83]

On 6/9/2022 at 3:28 AM, Rhinoww said:

It’s the cost to replace that stick that I am smoking to be able to maintain a wide and full working collection that bring tears of bitterness to my eyes. 
 

I’m in the same boat here. I’ve been smoking CCs sparingly lately, and smoking a lot more NCs. 

[Silverstix]

absolutely, unless you have an endless supply of disposable income.  knowing that the cigar you're smoking right now will cost you 2x to replace it kinda zaps the fun out of it - makes you either want to hoard them or cry as you toast the foot

[BrightonCorgi]

I plan to keep buying in the capacity I can.  Getting the new box is more fun to me than smoking the cigars.  Of course I love smoking cigars. Opening a new box is the best part.

[jakebarnes]

12 minutes ago, Silverstix said:

absolutely, unless you have an endless supply of disposable income.  knowing that the cigar you're smoking right now will cost you 2x to replace it kinda zaps the fun out of it - makes you either want to hoard them or cry as you toast the foot

I guess this is the crux of what I am getting at--can you (not just you specifically--all of us) differentiate between the cost to replace and the enjoyment in the moment? Is there something still there where it's an enjoyable ritual regardless of cost? 

[Lunettesman]

1 hour ago, djrey said:

Addressing enjoyment of cigars in the current climate is two pronged for me. One part of me realizes that I have 8 years of stock if I am careful and I should live in the moment and enjoy my smokes. Then there is the other side that has always enjoyed reading about new (to me) brands and vitolas that I haven't tried yet and getting excited about the new crops and vintages etc. All that is gone. Why read a review on a Cohiba or Trinidad anything? I'll never smoke one.

Even something like the humble D4. Unless something drastic changes I will never buy another box again. I have what I have and once its gone its gone. That to me is very depressing and I cant help but think about it every time I light one. There are many brands and vitolas that I never got to and likely never will at this point. And there will be no excitement of landing my first box on 24:24 and waiting for its arrival and the first time ever lighting one up. All that kid on Christmas feeling is gone.  So my whole enjoyment of reading and learning about brands, reviews and any future industry news has been effectively taken from me. 

I am brining some NC stock back into my CC rotation but it sucks because I simply do not enjoy the majority of them anymore, so I often feel like I am smoking something just to smoke. Its overall a depressing time. I am pretty much at HUHC only budget at this point while trying to stretch my larger format collection.

As a few mentioned above I am hoping to develop more appreciation for the smokes I do have and enjoy every single second.  

Well... In Depth opinion that i hadn't consider and will probably feel at some point. All the part of reading and being interested in general to the hobby will soon be gone if it continues that way.

[Bijan]

11 minutes ago, jakebarnes said:

I guess this is the crux of what I am getting at--can you (not just you specifically--all of us) differentiate between the cost to replace and the enjoyment in the moment? Is there something still there where it's an enjoyable ritual regardless of cost? 

It's not all 100% logic. I used to buy at Canadian retail prices in years past at 2x to 3x the prices you'd see online before the recent increases. I'd smoke maybe 2 boxes a year, when I was paying the equivalent of $600 for a box of Monte 4.

After I figured out you could get cheaper CCs online I started smoking more. Overall I was spending way more (smoking 1 or more cigars a day). But I felt I was getting good value.

You could say well if you smoke 300 cigars a year that's X dollars. And if cigars become twice as expensive just buy 150 cigars and smoke half as often. But one's enjoyment is also tied to the price (especially with the duds and tent pegs).

[Chas.Alpha]

With the exception of the Trini and Cohiba, I haven’t noticed a price increase that scares me away. That said, I’m still going to throw a tanty from time to time. Just to keep,you entertained! 😀

[Hammer Smokin']

yep. price increases are absolutely affecting my enjoyment .... of all things that have seen a price increase. Not just cuban cigars. 

I've cut my smoking by 50% (at least). Weed prices are stable, or in fact, decreasing, so I'm just smoking more pot and less cigars. 

And to think a year and a bit ago I considered moving away from weed completely, and only smoking cigars. 

So much for that thought. 

[cnov]

35 minutes ago, jakebarnes said:

I guess this is the crux of what I am getting at--can you (not just you specifically--all of us) differentiate between the cost to replace and the enjoyment in the moment? Is there something still there where it's an enjoyable ritual regardless of cost? 

There are certainly a lot of variables at play.

Personally, I don't have a big collection at all, it's for smoking. I was lucky to score some Esplendidos and CoRo 3 packs which will undoubtedly be enjoyed by me. A box of Siglo VI (10) and Fundadores (24) on the other hand, they set me back around $400 a piece, I'm not interested in the cash, but I'm certainly having thoughts about putting them on BR so I can buy 3-4 cheaper boxes in their place, I'll probably enjoy them more and I'll feel a lot less guilty about buying them if I'm playing with the houses money. Might be a different story of it was easy to buy a box of anything or I had a large stash.

I don't really get why someone would pay that much for a cigar, I really enjoy those moments where everything aligns and you get beautiful weather, a great drink, good company and a cigar that drawn perfectly and tastes sensational, but my expectations of a $100+ cigar would be fairly unachievable on my current disposable income. That would detract from my potential enjoyment in the moment. So many times in my life, great things have happened when I was least expecting it, you don't pay $100 for something like a cigar, bottle of wine or steak and not have high hopes, they've really got to hit the mark otherwise you're going to be disappointed.

 

 

 

[Duxnutz]

Thanks be to the rapid increase in Australian taxes (duty) I’m well positioned and reflect that we went trough this price reflection conversation prob close near a decade ago. Probably never smoke a La Trova now unless I trade a box of JL2 but I’ll prob enjoy the ones I smoke more now. 

[dshot]

Nah. It's just adapt or die time. More lower priced CC sticks and NC's these days for regular smokes. I find myself very conservative with my bigger sticks I've collected in the past. But in the end I don't give a sh*t. There just cigars like @El Presidente says. Supply goes down pricing goes up. Supply goes up pricing on some things goes down maybe or stays the same. It's all a cycle like the tide. Cigar pricing goes up my work pricing goes up as well. It's the way of the world today just have to learn to pivot with the times. Ask for that raise or price your work higher I dunno. Everything is on the up so move with it.

[SCgarman]

20 minutes ago, Chas.Alpha said:

With the exception of the Trini and Cohiba, I haven’t noticed a price increase that scares me away. That said, I’m still going to throw a tanty from time to time. Just to keep,you entertained! 😀

What if your favorite Bolivar PC's hit $500usd/ box? Will that make you flinch? If not Salud,  Don Corleone!!

[El Presidente]

absolutely!

The change of name could not have come at a better time 

For the first time, Ravi is thankful that he doesn't have a forum 

[Chibearsv]

4 minutes ago, SCgarman said:

What if your favorite Bolivar PC's hit $500usd/ box? Will that make you flinch? If not Salud,  Don Corleone!!

This is the bigger problem for sure.  Seems the baseline price for any CC has gotten to $450ish a box.  $12,000+ a year to support a 2-a-day cigar habit is some pretty heavy lifting. 

[Chas.Alpha]

7 minutes ago, SCgarman said:

What if your favorite Bolivar PC's hit $500usd/ box? Will that make you flinch? If not Salud,  Don Corleone!!

Yes. A $500 box of PC’s would make me flinch. 

[SCgarman]

2 minutes ago, Chibearsv said:

This is the bigger problem for sure.  Seems the baseline price for any CC has gotten to $450ish a box.  $12,000+ a year to support a 2-a-day cigar habit is some pretty heavy lifting. 

Yup, on top of $5/gallon gasoline which could keep climbing higher until who knows when? $200 to fill up the ol' F150 eventually? Ouch.

[El Presidente]

Picture the market as a piramide. 

The top 20% of that piramide don't see price as a factor. Nada. Zilch. 

They are now the Cohiba/Trini smokers and that is what Habanos want. I am still not convinced about Trinidad. 

The rest of the portfolio is now roughly in line with top end NC. 

Just assume you are getting boxes of 20 and that way you can account for the QC issues 

[asudevil08]

6 hours ago, Lunettesman said:

Last but not least. When I get a plugged stick, i m more frustrated than before. 

the perfec draw has never been such an apt tool as it is now...

[KCCubano]

38 minutes ago, Hammer Smokin' said:

yep. price increases are absolutely affecting my enjoyment .... of all things that have seen a price increase. Not just cuban cigars. 

I've cut my smoking by 50% (at least). Weed prices are stable, or in fact, decreasing, so I'm just smoking more pot and less cigars. 

And to think a year and a bit ago I considered moving away from weed completely, and only smoking cigars. 

So much for that thought. 

Wish I could say the same about medicinal dispo prices in Kansas City! Outrageous but I dont use that much. 

[PuroDiario]

I have been watching this topic on the sidelines for a bit in the forum. So here I go with my first hot take. 😆
 

Cuban cigars were mispriced, deeply mispriced. It is factual based on demand levels, scarcity, and perceived relative quality both tangible and intangible to other origins (ignore quality control point here). Forget the usual quality control chatter, Range Rovers engines are also discussed as shit and they still sell at crazy levels in a similar logic and fashion due to the perceived qualities of product, signaling, etc. albeit Habanos actually preserve and accrue value over time as opposed to Range Rovers.
 

If this pricing is the right one or not, or how this level impacts their quality control (hopefully) for the better and if the new price makes their sales tank, we are about to see.
 

The fact is that Padrón, Davidoff, Fuente, etc. have truly expensive lines doing well enough. apart from us cigar nerds, not many people globally will be able to tell what Padron and Fuente are relative to Cohiba / Montecristo, etc. meaning demand for a Cohiba is more like demand for Ferrari and Hermes (inelastic) than other goods. Probably is much more inelastic than for a Davidoff Royal or expensive Padron / Fuente. 
 

Further, my home market Spain one of the highest volume of cigar sales per capita. Vast amount of that volume is coming from people going to the Estancos buying in bulk and arbitraging that demand in China or markets such UK with more expensive prices, or grey vendors most here know well and are much more opaque than how our admired host operates. Estancos for example near the border with France have the highest sales volumes alongside German, UK, etc. tourists heavy locations. Because of that general mispricing being apparent at the country level to everyone.
 

if you are habanos and if your tobacco is the pinnacle of cigar enjoyment, your brands are the globally most appreciated and recognized, and the highest volume markets are actually driven at least partly by people taking advantage of your miss pricing what do you do? You re assess pricing, cause some shock which further redirects supply to wherever most profitable….

Chateua Lafite is mostly going to Asia, so is high end Scotch, etc. 

Don’t take me wrong, I hate the situation but is only logical they re price their portfolio. We will learn to live in this pricing level…some are already according to 24:24 time to sell out. Some where already according to Bond Roberts reports for key brands vitolas. 
 

Question now is if we should hold the Cohiba boxes untouched and sell them for 10x in a few years (relative to what we bought them for). 

[Greenhorn2]

I have what I  have and I bought them to smoke, so that's where I'm at.  I don't look at the original price(that money is long gone) and I don't look at how much to replace. If I can afford to replace a cigar I like, I  will. From the state Cuba is in with tobacco loss, personnel loss, the economic failures, has it dawned on us that in 5 to 10 years Cuban cigars may be a thing of the past? Will we live to smoke what we have? The prices are what they are, keep rowing or jump ship, no need bitching  about something I can't control. They are meant to be enjoyed,  don't take away from the experience by second guessing it.