For the NFL'ers : Brian Flores

[El Presidente]

I have been following this for the last week and and am enthralled. 

The guy could have walked into another head coach role if he stayed quiet and left gracefully. 

He did the opposite and lifted the lid on a hornets nest that he knows "may" end his career.  His case certainly appears thin on the surface. 

There are a lot of issues here. The "being asked and paid to tank" (allegedly) in order to achieve higher draft picks is probably the least of them. 

 The race issues have been raised before but he is taking it to a new level. 

I respect anyone who takes a stand on an issue when they know they will be pilloried. 

Gut feel. Good on him.  

 

 

[Cigar Surgeon]

[rguinn]

Shocked that coaches from bottom tier teams were incentivized to tank a season for better draft picks. I don’t understand the storyline here honestly. It’s slightly more of an interesting story with AA coaches being brought in to interview as a rule when they already have a coach hand selected. Although Flores didn’t do himself any favors in Miami in my opinion by how he handled Tua in favor of Watson and fighting with upper management on it for the entire season. 

[bassistheplace]

mixed feelings on this one. i have detested how woke the NFL has become. But if there is actual proof that he wasn't hired because of his skin color, that cannot and should not be tolerated.

Could also be this guy is just whining becuase he failed to keep his job and get hired, of course the Texans may give him the HC job and make this moot.

could be he is making money off of race baiting a la Kapernick

[MrBirdman]

24 minutes ago, El Presidente said:

I have been following this for the last week and and am enthralled. 

The guy could have walked into another head coach role if he stayed quiet and left gracefully. 

He did the opposite and lifted the lid on a hornets nest that he knows "may" end his career.  His case certainly appears thin on the surface. 

There are a lot of issues here. The "being asked and paid to tank" (allegedly) in order to achieve higher draft picks is probably the least of them. 

 The race issues have been raised before but he is taking it to a new level. 

I respect anyone who takes a stand on an issue when they know they will be pilloried. 

Gut feel. Good on him.  

 

 

I could not agree more. Flores was almost certain to get another shot somewhere after a firing most agree was ridiculous, and he saw what happened to Kaepernick. This is the kind of leadership that can truly spur change. Bravo.

[El Presidente]

1 minute ago, bassistheplace said:

Texans may give him the HC job and make this moot.

 

 

Would you ever hire someone who released personal text messages?

God knows I wouldn't 

[MrBirdman]

51 minutes ago, El Presidente said:

Would you ever hire someone who released personal text messages?

God knows I wouldn't 

Goodness no, me neither! He knew going in this would hinder if not eliminate his opportunity for another position, at least as a head coach. This only works as a play for change in the league - if he just wanted money or another job, he would've stayed silent. 

 

53 minutes ago, bassistheplace said:

could be he is making money off of race baiting a la Kapernick

Utter rubbish. Kaepernick's potential earnings in the league would've not only been significant, his only new endorsement deal since leaving the league was re-upping with Nike. Whether you agree with him or not, he almost certainly left tens of millions on the table and was forced out of a game he loved. He has integrity, which is a rare commodity among public personalities today.

[bassistheplace]

personally I wouldn't hire someone that airs dirty laundry on former employer, but have you seen what the Texans do?? They are moronic

 

Birdman i respectfully disagree. Kap was not a good QB. If he was he would have had a job. Once DC's figured out he was a one read pony that could run, they schemed and he could never get past that

His deal with Nike is pathetic

[El Presidente]

Just now, bassistheplace said:

 Kap was not a good QB. If he was he would have had a job.

Bass...I am going to respectfully disagree 

Mike Glennon has a QB job in the NFL. 

 

Case dismissed  

[bassistheplace]

Glennon, true. but Kap didnt want to be a backup

[El Presidente]

8 minutes ago, bassistheplace said:

Glennon, true. but Kap didnt want to be a backup

I  couldn't believe Chicago paid $18 M for a Buccaneers back up. 

I still can't believe he is in the game at all. 

[bassistheplace]

Da Bears are another team that made some dumb decisions. hence regime change

[inter4alia]

Friend of mine is a huge dolphins fan and knows all the ins and outs of the team. He told me Flores is a horrible coach and is disliked by many of his current and former players. In today's day and age if most of your players think you are a bad coach, that information gets around and it's unlikely that you will get another head coach opportunity in the league unless you are an old head with an impressive record. The writing was on the wall and Flores knew it, so the lawsuit was his only play. Was the NFL not racist a few years ago when the Dolphins hired him as HC but the NFL just became racist over the past couple of years? 

[riderpride]

Is there inequality at the head coaching level? Yes, changes must be made. Just not sure what.

Does the Rooney rule help in its current form? Not anymore.

Was the above rule broken bt the Giants or Broncos? No, there's evidence otherwise. 

Does Billichek's text reveal the rule was broken or anything was racist? No. It can be interpreted multiple ways and he was not party to those discussions 

Is Dolphins owner Ross racist? Dunno. Grier remains on the team as GM at six years and counting. He was the director of college scouting for 9 or 10 years before that. They were the only franchise to have both a black GM and HC.

Did Flores deserve to be fired? Probably. Prior coaches were fired by Ross with similar records. All evidence points to a dysfunctional environment that he was a key part of. The players seemed to rejoice with his departure,  and he could never hire a staff. 4 OCs in 3 years with this season having co-OCs. He hired and fired an experienced OL coach after 4 days on a 'gut feel' and eventually replaced him with someone who has high school level experience (sounds crazy,  but actually true). Extended losing streak each year - i'll give him year one with a bad roster. This year's turnaround was after he essentially stopped communicating with Grier and staff. He was difficult to work with and alienated his starting QB after having him play behind the 32nd ranked OL and no running game. That's brutal and isn't indicative of good leadership. 

Interference with Brady? Nope, that's his job to say no and educate his boss.

Was he told to tank but refused to? Not sure and looking forward to the evidence. 

Does Bienemy (sp) deserve a head coaching position? His criminal record is prohibitive. Multiple arrests including assaulting a woman would be a hard sell for someone with a Head Coaching position.

Is anything racist here? I don't know,  but it will be hard to prove. The NFL should look at other ways to promote diversity,  but this lawsuit seems confusing feelings with facts. Pederson won a super bowl and was just hired again after a year off. That's a much better resume 

Best of luck to Flores if the allegations are true, but it will be a tough battle as racism is hard to prove and there's enough evidence to conclude he isn't entitled to another HC position immediately. Hope he has some solid evidence and I look forward to seeing it.

Cheers!

[Huckleberry]

The problem in today's society is there is so much of the "boy who cried wolf."  I don't know what happened, I don't know if it will ever be possible to know what happened.  For the sake of Coach Flores, I hope he has all the incontrovertible evidence he needs to support his story and back his claims.  If he is a victim of racism in any form I hope the perpetrators get what is coming to them.  If he is lying or manufacturing truth to fit a narrative, I hope he is held equally accountable.

From what I have heard about him he is a talented coach and more than qualified to be a Head Coach in the NFL.

I will refrain from commenting on Kap.

Dolphins, Bears, Jets, Lions all appear to be completely broken franchises.

[KCCubano]

3 hours ago, El Presidente said:

 

Would you ever hire someone who released personal text messages?

God knows I wouldn't 

HELL NO!!!!!!!

[Ken Gargett]

4 hours ago, Cigar Surgeon said:

best post of the year. 

if there really is a witness to the tanking requests then it will get very interesting. saw one report that said the NFL would insist on the team being sold. if that is true then could we have all previous washington coaches claiming dan paid them to tank please. 

[Dwamon]

There’s no winner in this. Flores did win 8 of last 9, but reports are he had no relationship with his QB, Tua, because he was mad he wouldn’t spend off days not watching film and instead chose to golf.

The text messages look awful and I think definitely give Flores a case. I’ve also been reading that Belichek intentionally may have sent them knowing it’d screw over the NFL. I mean how does a guy work for you for 14 years and you don’t know who you’re sending the right text message to vs the other guy?

On the whole many solid points by Flores— it’s a shame when the league is 80% players of color and only 3/32 coaches are minorities.

Hoping something more equitable comes from this and applaud Flores for his courage, even if it’s at the detriment of his career.

[MrBirdman]

Let's be clear - my respect for Flores arises from the risk he's taking in pursuit of a just cause he believes in. As for the allegations themselves, that's a different story. The evidence in Flores' filing is nowhere near conclusive. His attorneys are hoping it is enough for the case to proceed to discovery, but even that is a steep climb from what I've seen. The Rooney Rule isn't a federal law. And his filing the suit as a class-action has little shot of being certified, meaning that even if it did move forward the scope of discovery would be substantially reduced.

 

4 hours ago, inter4alia said:

He told me Flores is a horrible coach and is disliked by many of his current and former players.

I find this hard to believe simply because the team never gave up on him even after their horrific start. You don't start 1-7 and then win 8 of 9 if players aren't buying into the coach. Everyone in Philly was cursing the Dolphins to heck once they started winning games - we figured a top-5 pick was in the bag.

[Chibearsv]

19 hours ago, El Presidente said:

I  couldn't believe Chicago paid $18 M for a Buccaneers back up. 

I still can't believe he is in the game at all. 

"I can't believe...." regarding a dumb decision made by my beloved Bears is what we call "just another day at the office".

 

Some opinions

Upper management employees should expect to be fired or they should resign if they don't or won't follow a directive from owners. 

Upper management employees are expected to maintain complete confidentiality for all company business, even post employment - If news gets out that a coach is whistle-blowing on a private business discussion with an owner, he's going to find it very difficult to get hired.  That would be the same in almost every business.  This doesn't mean things should be OK for the team owner, but it doesn't mean anyone else will be obligated to hire the whistle-blower either.

I'm not sure racism had or has anything to do with how Flores was or is being treated but I would generally not defend the NFL owners regarding racism.

[riderpride]

On 2/4/2022 at 9:21 PM, MrBirdman said:

I find this hard to believe simply because the team never gave up on him even after their horrific start. You don't start 1-7 and then win 8 of 9 if players aren't buying into the coach. Everyone in Philly was cursing the Dolphins to heck once they started winning games - we figured a top-5 pick was in the bag.

They did quit on him though. The only time anyone was near him on the sidelines was to walk somewhere else. He quit communicating with the team.

Their sched was also pretty weak during the winning streak. Jets twice, giants, saints with a 4th string qb, Panthers and texans. The beat new England on 2 defensive TDs and were absolutely annihilated by the Henry-less Titans in week 17.

If it makes you feel any better, the other first rd pick they could have traded in that deal was from the 49ers 😂

Cheers!