Question on the E2's

[Tstew75]

I was hoping more folks would chime in here. I love talking about this lol

Cuban factory lore is so damn intriguing, and part of what makes CCs so mysterious...

[Taco]

You’d think EL would have the best, most consistent rollers. If that’s the case, I’d want EL boxes to cut down on any duds. Same goes for distribution of quality tobacco. 

[Tstew75]

On 12/9/2020 at 6:52 PM, Taco said:

You’d think EL would have the best, most consistent rollers. If that’s the case, I’d want EL boxes to cut down on any duds. Same goes for distribution of quality tobacco. 

This is a whole other can of worms. Getting away with using rough, sub-par wrappers on ELs and also rolling at least 50% of them  at provincial as opposed to mother factories. It's bewildering at best.

[Tstew75]

@El Presidente ?

[Gamehawker]

2 hours ago, Tstew75 said:

@El Presidente ?

Yup, it has been over a month since he started this thread.

It is time now for what he said on his initial post:  "I have my thoughts but I will jump in once this is kicked around for a while "

[Tstew75]

While we're waiting I'll hedge my bets & continue to buy UAO/MAR boxes ?

[Gamehawker]

21 minutes ago, Tstew75 said:

While we're waiting I'll hedge my bets & continue to buy UAO/MAR boxes ?

Sounds like a good idea. ?

[PuroDan]

On 12/3/2020 at 5:54 PM, TTP21 said:

My disclaimer - Limited sample size for me.  Construction and quality, zero difference.  Flavor is where I have noticed a difference whereas the non-El Laguito are like D4 and Lusi but smooth as can be.  The El Laguna are the opposite - incredibly strong and in need of some serious down time.  At least I hope that's a cure for them to this point. I taste the potential for sure, but they're incredibly potent. 

I agree 100% with this. If you want to smoke now stay away from EL. It seems like a different blend? If you want to age go with EL.

[Jimmy_jack]

Amo May 2016 box from host. So so disappointing. I revisited this box because of this thread. It’s been a while since I’ve had one. White pepper and nothing else. Horrible burn. Just one sampling but sad none the less.

[Hammer Smokin']

That's my experience with E2's. 

I know it is limited, having only smoked 10 or so in my time...but that isn't one I seek out to purchase. 

[djrey]

I'm curious, what blend seems to be stronger/better suitable for aging, E2 or P2? I have had P2's but haven't had E2 yet mostly because its not my ideal ring. 

[Tstew75]

21 hours ago, Jimmy_jack said:

Amo May 2016 box from host. So so disappointing. I revisited this box because of this thread. It’s been a while since I’ve had one. White pepper and nothing else. Horrible burn. Just one sampling but sad none the less.

It's worth noting 16s were pretty bad all around. Likely the worst year for CCs in that decade, IMO

 

6 hours ago, djrey said:

I'm curious, what blend seems to be stronger/better suitable for aging, E2 or P2? I have had P2's but haven't had E2 yet mostly because its not my ideal ring. 

While you'd have to assume these 2 vitolas are the same blend, i sense they smoke different b/c of shape. For me P2s smoke a bit more powerfully & E2s seem to have an elegance about them.

I'm with you, not a huge fan of the size, but every time I smoke one I'm so F'n happy. I'd venture to say E2 is a Top 10 CC, and worth seeking out when rolled at Partagas. Pure joy.

[Cairo]

I have only had one ten year plus aged P2, and it absolutely blew me away with power plus a wild explosion of flavor with what seemed like berries plus some other fruits (that may not actually exist  ?  ).

I have a couple of boxes in deep storage--hoping for the best.

[Fugu]

5 hours ago, Tstew75 said:

It's worth noting 16s were pretty bad all around. Likely the worst year for CCs in that decade, IMO

... for that which must not, cannot be.... 

[Tstew75]

23 hours ago, Fugu said:

... for that which must not, cannot be.... 

No comprehende ?

[Gamehawker]

On 1/4/2021 at 1:41 PM, Gamehawker said:

Yup, it has been over a month since he started this thread.

It is time now for what he said on his initial post:  "I have my thoughts but I will jump in once this is kicked around for a while "

TTT

Hey Pres,

Are you ever going to jump in with your thoughts on this post that you created and you said that you would?

It is time now for what he said on his initial post:  "I have my thoughts but I will jump in once this is kicked around for a while "

[Bords]

I have a bundle of cigars reported to be back door EL E2 as well as some 5 packs purchased in Havana (Libre). The banded/boxed versions (not EL) are completely forgettable, hot air for the first half and a hint of Partagas on the back end. The “Backdoor” E2 are some of the best cigars I have after only 2 years aging. Absolutely sublime and stand head to head with siglo 6 IMO. I give away the boxed/banded E2, wish I could source more of the unbanded. The leaf is top notch and the burn is a thing of beauty despite average looking wrappers.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[Gamehawker]

On 1/8/2021 at 10:40 AM, Gamehawker said:

TTT

Hey Pres,

Are you ever going to jump in with your thoughts on this post that you created and you said that you would?

It is time now for what he said on his initial post:  "I have my thoughts but I will jump in once this is kicked around for a while "

Tap, tap tap

Hey Pres,

Are you ever going to give your thoughts on this thread like you said that you were going to on your initial post?

I and like a lot of other people would appreciate your thoughts and insights.

TIA

[Gamehawker]

On 1/12/2021 at 9:42 AM, Gamehawker said:

Tap, tap tap

Hey Pres,

Are you ever going to give your thoughts on this thread like you said that you were going to on your initial post?

I and like a lot of other people would appreciate your thoughts and insights.

TIA

 

TTT

Hey Pres,

Are you ever going to give your thoughts on this thread like you said that you were going to on your initial post?

Thanks

[Boxer31]

I bit on 2x 5 count boxes that were offered up as handpicked.  Just received them other day and the look/feel/aroma is unbelievable.  Going to be a challenge to hold off until spring when I can get warmer weather and can just enjoy without the chill. Looking forward to the reviews/exchanges until then

[Tstew75]

Thx for keeping this thread alive guys ?

Long live UAO PSE2s ?

[hedgeybaby]

On 12/4/2020 at 9:24 PM, PuroDiario said:

To make an analogy, and risking getting some heat, for the most part I think factory codes are like looking at the numbers board by the roulette in a Casino...it does not change the odds of the game whatsoever no matter how much you look at it...more like you had one that you liked, you looked at the code and saw it was Laguito and said aha! Or you first looked at the code and were pre-conditioned to like it after seeing the code.

I would bet if you smoke for about a year two E2s/day blindly of different years one cigar per factory code and you were asked to chose what you are smoking (Laguito vs No Laguito) you would end up with a binomial distribution...no different than tossing a coin for enough times (maybe we need you to smoke 4 a day instead of 2)...

I very much like the cut of you gib.

[PuroDiario]

On 12/7/2020 at 11:15 AM, Tstew75 said:

Interesting for sure. MOL/UEB/EOS were big surprises. Kind of nice to see 3 mother factories in the Top 6, reinforcing their enduring quality. 

The conundrum comes when those provincial codes changed & you're flying blind again. Not so with EL, LC, PS.

Top Box lists are a lagging indicator, not leading imho

[Tstew75]

13 hours ago, PuroDiario said:

Top Box lists are a lagging indicator, not leading imho

Not sure I understand your point. Care to clarify?

[PuroDiario]

Of course, should have alongside the previous post. Allow me to write a long post here - and tbh, I did not mean to quote your post directly, as I was not necessarily trying to respond to it (did by mistake). Just general contribution to the debate, So apologies.

If we discussed this analogous to business Key Performance Indicators (to make a management analogy):

A lagging indicator measures output, hence it is a backward looking explanation/assessment of performance and gives you an observable trend and factual yet not complete explanation for performance. However, it does not definitionally show high correlation with future performance and usually fails to work well as a predictive tool (regardless of field of study: Infra, health, cigars quality). These indicators exist only after the measurable event takes place and helps explain its nature and a range of possible effects.
 

On the other hand a leading indicator is a “reliable”, or very highly correlated with outcome, predictive measure; measures input. Hence a good tool for assessing performance (high correlation). These indicators exist before the measurable event (performance/quality in this case) exists or takes place.

For example if we looked at making an investment decision in consumer internet stocks, or we for example were looking to invest in Bond Roberts as venture capitalists would:

1) leading indicators of future performance are daily active users, web traffic, bounce rate, average time spent in the site, average revenue per user, open rates for email notifications on new boxes being auctioned

2) lagging indicators would be marketing $ per new seller/buyer that transacts (customer acquisition cost), repeat rates (churn of your existing sellers/buyers), Average Order Values or average $/cigar auctioned, total revenues, total auctioned volumes, brand recognition, etc

In the general economy:

1) leading indicators are things like jobless claims

2) lagging indicators are things like GDP or interest rates

And after all this long post:

when I look at Box Codes only after assessing the quality of the cigars in the bunch, is the Box Code able to provide an indication / explanation of quality (aha! It was El Laguito). But buying el laguito over a sizeable enough sample does not guarantee or highly correlates to outsized quality. 
 

To make an investment decision without opening boxes and trying cigars in the boxes you would be more likely to optimize your boxes quality looking at: average years rolling cigars per roller in the factory (assuming that correlates with who’s rolling what vitola), number of vitolas and marcas rolled in the factory (how focused are they in excellence in a limited number of products), precedence of leaf distributed to each factory, status of equipment (for example is draw testing equipment in the factory well maintained, etc), satisfaction levels of rollers in that factory, rejection rates for boxes in the quality control of that factory (assuming the process is being implemented efficiently), what codes are the tier 1 global distributors taking for the top countries (for example UK codes here can probably be taken as leading).

So my view is in general investing behind codes guarantees very close to nothing other than some emotional attachment to Cuban cigar mystique.

happy Sunday!