When I smoke a NC.....

[Silverstix]

**WARNING** SARCASM AHEAD - APPROACH WITH CAUTION 

....usually the first thing I think is “why am I smoking this?”

^^That was the sarcasm part ?

......but shortly thereafter, I always think “if Cuba could figure out QC like this, my god, just take all my money now!”

 

Anybody else with me on the construction?

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Habana Mike]

Cuban tobacco with NC QA. Huge!

[JoeyBones777]

I'm with you. I also wish some NC brands could get good quality Cuban tobacco to use for their own blends. I'd love to see an Illusione, Warped and Tatuaje Cuban puro! 

[nKostyan]

......but shortly thereafter, I always think “if Cuba could figure out QC like this, my god, just take all my money now!”
 
Anybody else with me?

Want to get CC at the price of OpusX? I'm against

[Notsocleaver]

Oh man, I was totally thinking that same thing last night while smoking a Warped La Hacienda. I grabbed it and it was heavy, solid in my hands. Zero give when you squeeze it. After pretty much smoking nothing but Cubans for the past 5 years I thought 'this is plugged for sure'. The draw was perfect. But I have been so traumatized by Cuba that I have forgotten how well a cigar can be rolled. The whole box has been like that, and coming in about $2 cheaper than a similar sized Cuban. Well blended too, but it just doesn't have that smooth Cuban funk.

[Silverstix]

6 hours ago, nKostyan said:

 

Want to get CC at the price of OpusX? I'm against

 

At the price of Opus???? Heck no!!!! Not even at the price of Davidoff...

Don't have to spend that kind of money for quality control, there are plenty of non-cubans that are <$10 with superb construction consistently.  Wish Cuba could figure this out 

[Silverstix]

4 hours ago, Notsocleaver said:

Oh man, I was totally thinking that same thing last night while smoking a Warped La Hacienda. I grabbed it and it was heavy, solid in my hands. Zero give when you squeeze it. After pretty much smoking nothing but Cubans for the past 5 years I thought 'this is plugged for sure'. The draw was perfect. But I have been so traumatized by Cuba that I have forgotten how well a cigar can be rolled. The whole box has been like that, and coming in about $2 cheaper than a similar sized Cuban. Well blended too, but it just doesn't have that smooth Cuban funk.

That's where I'm at, just don't love the flavor profile on most NC's

[Monterey]

Plenty of wonderful non-cubans.  Such a silly statement.

[lovethehaze]

i smoke lots of both and there are plenty of good nc to be had just like anything else good and bad in all

[Silverstix]

11 hours ago, Monterey said:

Plenty of wonderful non-cubans.  Such a silly statement.

Relax I was being sarcastic 

Would love to hear your thought on QC though - watch the silliness ?

 

11 hours ago, lovethehaze said:

i smoke lots of both and there are plenty of good nc to be had just like anything else good and bad in all

It was a facetious statement.  I was opining on the difference in quality control between NC and CC

[xtcat9k]

I would have never brought a PerfecDraw if I only smoked NC. 

 

[lovethehaze]

10 hours ago, Silverstix said:

It was a facetious statement.  I was opining on the difference in quality control between NC and CC

I really don't have a quality control issue with cc honestly it's pretty rare that I have an issue with the construction side, except for maybe one box of punch punch that is just an insult to humanity, that aside maybe 99% of my experience has been good with cc. I honestly feel like the flavors are usually better, twangy and more mild as a general rule but plenty of great nc's to be had. I have also had as many issues with nc, usually they tunnel really bad when they go bad as opposed to cc being unsmokeable b/c of tight roles that are unbreakable, but both outcomes are not good.

Maybe I'm lucky in this regard but over time as I have accumulated many more cc's the issue becomes almost non existent. It could be i let them rest as needed, dry box for extended time if they feel as if they need it, or maybe my hopes aren't as high .... to anything else one could guess. I feel at some point you can truly feel when a cigar is ready; no measurements needed it just feels right. does this make sense ?

I have seen many posts similar to this and wonder ....

1. why do you smoke them ?

2. am i just lucky ?

[Silverstix]

10 hours ago, lovethehaze said:

I really don't have a quality control issue with cc honestly it's pretty rare that I have an issue with the construction side, except for maybe one box of punch punch that is just an insult to humanity, that aside maybe 99% of my experience has been good with cc. I honestly feel like the flavors are usually better, twangy and more mild as a general rule but plenty of great nc's to be had. I have also had as many issues with nc, usually they tunnel really bad when they go bad as opposed to cc being unsmokeable b/c of tight roles that are unbreakable, but both outcomes are not good.

Maybe I'm lucky in this regard but over time as I have accumulated many more cc's the issue becomes almost non existent. It could be i let them rest as needed, dry box for extended time if they feel as if they need it, or maybe my hopes aren't as high .... to anything else one could guess. I feel at some point you can truly feel when a cigar is ready; no measurements needed it just feels right. does this make sense ?

I have seen many posts similar to this and wonder ....

1. why do you smoke them ?

2. am i just lucky ?

So I started out with NC's way before discovering CC's and getting the courage to actually place that first order.  I still have over 500 NC sticks, some of which I do like, some of which I can't sell so I smoke them in the yard or on the boat when I am not able to sit down and focus on the cigar.  Last night I smoked one because I wanted to smoke, but it was my 2nd cigar of the day and my palate usually doesn't pick much up on the 2nd of the day.  So rather than waste a Cuban, I smoked an NC instead.  As I smoked it, I thought, man these cigars have smoked GREAT but I sooooo wish I liked the flavor profile better.

No, I'm not talking about dry boxing or resting.  Those are the obvious.  I'm talking about simply poor rolling and poor construction through no fault of the smoker.  You've had those experiences, we all have.  My personal experience, way more swings and misses in Cubans than there are in other cigars.  I think many people would agree with my experiences. I'm talking comparable premium cigars, of course.  Is it unacceptable? No. But, why is it like this?  How come Cuba can't get this figured out?

To answer your questions:

1) Generally speaking, I like Cuban tobacco better than tobacco from other parts of the world.  And that's why I put up with less than perfection in the construction department.  But the point of my post - could you imagine if Cubans smoked like a Padron or a Fuente?  Imagine marrying all the things you love about the Cuban flavor profile with all of the great construction from NC manufacturers.  That would be amazing!!!!

2) We all have different tolerances, right?  To me, it's annoying to have to worry about a burn line or to puff more frequently to keep a cigar burning.  That stuff takes away from my enjoyment.  Other people may not see this as an issue.  I want to light a cigar, smoke a cigar, enjoy a cigar.  I wish this happened more frequently with Cuban tobacco.

[djrey]

It’s funny how pardon is still considered an apex brand for NC. It is the one brand I will never buy a box of as 75% are under-filled. I go to my local BM and hand select them. 
 

If you want beautiful construction I feel nothing touches anything from the My Father factory (Tatuaje is rolled there) or the Tabsa factory where Warped and Illusione hail from. Beautiful sticks and usually some nice flavors, but they aren’t Cuban ?

[SmokyFontaine]

1 hour ago, djrey said:

It’s funny how pardon is still considered an apex brand for NC. It is the one brand I will never buy a box of as 75% are under-filled. I go to my local BM and hand select them. 
 

If you want beautiful construction I feel nothing touches anything from the My Father factory (Tatuaje is rolled there) or the Tabsa factory where Warped and Illusione hail from. Beautiful sticks and usually some nice flavors, but they aren’t Cuban ?

Just couldn't disagree with you more on the Padron statement. The draw is phenomenal, if erring on the loose side, but I don't even call it erring, because burn time for any of the respective vitolas is right on par with other cigars. It allows a lighter pull, which helps me better taste the cigar. Padron for me is the still the worldwide benchmark. I don't have better cigars than a 1926 or 1964 Padron. Every single one is outstanding. The Oliva Melanio series isn't far behind that. Similar in draw, 2/3rds Nicaraguan if I'm not mistaken. Fuentes are one NC that remind me the most of flavor similarities with CC, and I enjoy the Hemingway, 858, and Anejo lines a ton. To me, my collection would be entirely incomplete without both NC and CC in them. There are some hardcore connoisseurs and specialists in this forum. People with experience and knowledge I'll likely never match. Having said that, I'll bet there is a sizable lot where if you gave them an unbanded cigar and told them it was a Cuban, they'd devour it and rave about it. If you told them it was a NC, they'd explain how easily they could tell, because the tobacco just wasn't as good. It's confirmation bias. 

My view on the two - NC's are going to deliver the same flavor damn near every time. You're going to have so few dud cigars that if you like one stick a lot, you could buy 10 boxes and love each one. CC's are wholly unique. You could have one that is the most amazing, complex, beautiful experience you could ever hope for. Then literally the next 9 out of the box could be horsecrap. At least for me, part of the allure (and a majority of the frustration) is this phenomenon. You're always chasing that special single cigar, and each time you light up, you just don't know which way it's going to go. Then, you throw in the concept of age? The NC you are going to smoke was aged how the roller intended. You're going to smoke a reflection of their dream. The CC you're going to smoke might be one of those that is perfect young. Or maybe it's going to be one that you won't really get the most out of until it's 3yrs...or 5..or 10 years old. Sure taste is subjective, but I think we've all experience a "young" cigar that was enough to convince us to shelf it and come back later. CC appreciation is a commitment. I make it because the payoff is there, but with a special set of expectations and rules. 

[djrey]

59 minutes ago, SmokyFontaine said:

Just couldn't disagree with you more on the Padron statement. The draw is phenomenal, if erring on the loose side, but I don't even call it erring, because burn time for any of the respective vitolas is right on par with other cigars. It allows a lighter pull, which helps me better taste the cigar. Padron for me is the still the worldwide benchmark. I don't have better cigars than a 1926 or 1964 Padron. Every single one is outstanding. The Oliva Melanio series isn't far behind that. Similar in draw, 2/3rds Nicaraguan if I'm not mistaken. Fuentes are one NC that remind me the most of flavor similarities with CC, and I enjoy the Hemingway, 858, and Anejo lines a ton. To me, my collection would be entirely incomplete without both NC and CC in them. There are some hardcore connoisseurs and specialists in this forum. People with experience and knowledge I'll likely never match. Having said that, I'll bet there is a sizable lot where if you gave them an unbanded cigar and told them it was a Cuban, they'd devour it and rave about it. If you told them it was a NC, they'd explain how easily they could tell, because the tobacco just wasn't as good. It's confirmation bias. 

My view on the two - NC's are going to deliver the same flavor damn near every time. You're going to have so few dud cigars that if you like one stick a lot, you could buy 10 boxes and love each one. CC's are wholly unique. You could have one that is the most amazing, complex, beautiful experience you could ever hope for. Then literally the next 9 out of the box could be horsecrap. At least for me, part of the allure (and a majority of the frustration) is this phenomenon. You're always chasing that special single cigar, and each time you light up, you just don't know which way it's going to go. Then, you throw in the concept of age? The NC you are going to smoke was aged how the roller intended. You're going to smoke a reflection of their dream. The CC you're going to smoke might be one of those that is perfect young. Or maybe it's going to be one that you won't really get the most out of until it's 3yrs...or 5..or 10 years old. Sure taste is subjective, but I think we've all experience a "young" cigar that was enough to convince us to shelf it and come back later. CC appreciation is a commitment. I make it because the payoff is there, but with a special set of expectations and rules. 

I probably should have expanded on this more. The Padron that have given me the most trouble are the 1000 series. They used to be budget sticks usually costing $3-$6 depending on size but have since gone up quite a bit with a 3000 robusto going around $7. While still not an expensive cigar they aren’t cheap and cheerful anymore. They are generally under filled Wind tunnels, which at $7 a stick shouldn't happen. It was forgivable when they were cheapies. Do a google search for under filled padron and watch the results pour in.

Now it seems you are mostly talking about the 1926 and 1964. I have never found a liking to them but I will say of the 15-20 I have smoked they have all been rolled very very well. But at $12 entry price I would certainly expect that to be the case.
 

I would 100% agree however that when you light a Padron, you are almost 100% going to get the same flavor experience day in day out. Just wish they would stop those awful sloppy single caps.

[SmokyFontaine]

I can agree to that. The single cap on a "premium" cigar is just a headscratcher. Haa haa. 

If I'm not smoking a 26/64, then it's usually a 2000 natural. Have only smoked 8-10 and don't recall any draw issues. Again, to me burn time is very telling. A cigar could feel loose, but if it's burning the same as a similar vitola, it seems like that could just be the blend. If a robosuto takes someone an hour fifteen, then a Padron takes them 30, that would stand out more to me. But then again, the whole thing is subjective, so we're just lucky there is such an array of options from all over the world. There is something for everyone!

[djrey]

I hear ya on that. Padron Londres and 2000 are my go to for the brand. Very enjoyable smokes and one that I still point a lot of newer smokers too. You really can’t go wrong 

[Nico]

It’s funny how pardon is still considered an apex brand for NC. It is the one brand I will never buy a box of as 75% are under-filled. I go to my local BM and hand select them. 

Agreed. Padrón are windtunnels. Same goes for some of the rocky patels.

On the whole CC vs. NC thing. If people want to stick to CCs only that’s fine, but I can’t really wrap my head around it. It’s like listening to only one genre of music, or drinking wine from just one region. For me, it’s just boring. I want variety. But I admit that I reach for NCs sometimes because I don’t have the energy for construction problems. Especially if I’ve had multiple CCs in a row with construction problems. And the other way around, I reach for CCs because the last couple of NCs were mediocre.
I think a lot of habanophiles could appreciate a NC if they just go through the same journey they did when they were new to cubans. I understand it’s an effort though and some people just don’t have the patience or energy.

[Notsocleaver]

Don't get me wrong, I do think that Cuba is doing much better than they were 10-20 years ago. Most CCs I smoke now have acceptable draws. But some of these NCs coming out of My Father, Tabsa, etc are just a world better.

[The Real McCoy]

9 hours ago, djrey said:

It’s funny how pardon is still considered an apex brand for NC. It is the one brand I will never buy a box of as 75% are under-filled. I go to my local BM and hand select them. 
 

If you want beautiful construction I feel nothing touches anything from the My Father factory (Tatuaje is rolled there) or the Tabsa factory where Warped and Illusione hail from. Beautiful sticks and usually some nice flavors, but they aren’t Cuban ?

I disagree with you about Padron. I find the Padron brand the most reliable, most consistently well-made cigar on the market, especially all the anniversary series. As someone else mentioned, they intentionally have a slightly loose draw but they do it so well. The volume of smoke those things create is phenomenal. Also, totally agree with your assessment of the My Father factory. Every single cigar they touch is delicious. They're my favorite NC cigar company, by far.

 

I've got more than 1,000 NC cigars. I love non-cuban tobacco but only certain brands. I usually don't care for Dominican or Honduran unless it's something exceptional. Most of my stash was rolled at the My Father cigar factory. They just make great cigars. Period. Even when they're rolling for other brands. I had a special meal with a wine pairing the other night. After dinner, slightly tipsy, I wanted to relax with a nice cigar. I couldn't bring myself to grab a cuban because I didn't want to hassle with any quality control issues. I wanted to be able to relax and enjoy it without worrying about it being plugged or, worse, tasting wrong. So I grabbed a My Father 10th Anniversary cigar from 2018. It was perfection.

[jazzboypro]

7 hours ago, djrey said:

It’s funny how pardon is still considered an apex brand for NC. It is the one brand I will never buy a box of as 75% are under-filled. I go to my local BM and hand select them. 
 

If you want beautiful construction I feel nothing touches anything from the My Father factory (Tatuaje is rolled there) or the Tabsa factory where Warped and Illusione hail from. Beautiful sticks and usually some nice flavors, but they aren’t Cuban ?

Personally, Padron is one of the most overrated and overpriced cigars in the NC world.

[Smokecigareveryday]

I am probably a minority on this issue but I don't "feel" the connection when I take a draw with NCs even if they have perfect draw and burn.

 

2 hours ago, jazzboypro said:

Personally, Padron is one of the most overrated and overpriced cigars in the NC world.

I agree.

[Kayslay]

In a sick way the shit QC of CCs is part of the allure.?

It makes the one that burns perfectly that much better. 

But the fact of the matter IS that the Cuban leaf is superior. Hands down. Some NCs have a sweetness to them that is nauseating. The Maduros are too Maduro. The QC is leaps and bounds better. But here I am, a member of Friends of Habanos because I love the Cuban leaf.

[Kayslay]

And to be honest I've never had a Padron that blew my socks off in terms of flavor. Its just not there.