FOHrensics : 60 Day Transition Thread: Evolution of R&J Churchills and Monte 2

[El Presidente]

 

The purpose of this thread is to help shine a light on the transition of cigars over the first 60 days post international shipping. 

Purchasers of the Romeo y Julieta Churchills and Montecristo Number 2 on the 12^th of March 2020 were asked to do the following.  

• Photograph boxes on arrival (Natural Light, distance of no more than one foot)
• Smoke one in the first week. : Review on the dedicated thread: Put them away. 
• 30 days: Photograph the box in identical conditions as first photo. Smoke one :Review and Rate : Put them away
• 60 Days: complete the above again.
• Write an overview of what you found. 

    Steve will help me collate the data.

If you manage to complete the above, you will receive a $50 voucher towards the purchase of another  box of cigars. The voucher is to be used within 60 days of the final results being posted.

 

Use this thread to complete the above as the boxes will start arriving. 

 

Step one is to photograph the open box ((Natural Light, distance of no more than one foot), smoke and review the cigar within 7 days of arrival. 

 

Let's focus on this step for now. 

Photo and review in one post on this thread. 

Review to cover:

• photo  + brief description of cigars (colour/sheen/aroma at cold)
• Opening/first third  (body/flavour/burn/anything else)
• Mid/second third (body/flavour/burn/anything else)
• Finish/last third (body/flavour/burn/anything else )
• Summary and your score. 

 

Remember,  Step one ot be completed within 7 days of receipt. 

[prodigy]

I'm curious what these results will show.

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[Reverb]

Got my box today, March 25, 2020!  I pulled one out of the box ROTT and it has a decent heft to it.  Beautiful color, nice shine, lit it up, great draw, all mongrel.

First Third

Burnt popcorn with a lingering chemical aftertaste.  Burnt grass, wet burlap, and more burnt popcorn.

Second Third

Mushroomy dirt coming through with a touch of kerosene.  The burn is decent, good thick smoke, perfect draw, and turning mossy.

Third Third

I didn't make it that far.

I'll be back with an update in 30 days!

[Wookie]

Received my box the other day  MSA OCT 19

1/3 typical light/med profile with trademark cherry flavor and clearly young (2019 box)

2/3 body starts to grow and flavors remain same—-still plenty of mongrel.

3/3 now medium full and really satisfying. Yes it’s young but no denying that RyJ is back as the floral/cherry is so necessary...reason that this vitola is famous. 

[rcarlson]

17 hours ago, Reverb said:

Got my box today, March 25, 2020!  I pulled one out of the box ROTT and it has a decent heft to it.  Beautiful color, nice shine, lit it up, great draw, all mongrel.

First Third

Burnt popcorn with a lingering chemical aftertaste.  Burnt grass, wet burlap, and more burnt popcorn.

Second Third

Mushroomy dirt coming through with a touch of kerosene.  The burn is decent, good thick smoke, perfect draw, and turning mossy.

Third Third

I didn't make it that far.

I'll be back with an update in 30 days!

 

Burnt popcorn, lingering chemical, burnt grass, wet burlap, mushroomy dirt, kerosene and moss.  What's not to like?  

Sounds like some Islay whiskys I've had.   

[Chibearsv]

Received this box on the 26th of March.  TPO MAR 19

Nice chocolate brown color.  Slight sheen.  Wrappers are a bit bumpy and slightly mottled.

Construction on the cigar I pulled was ok, there was a soft spot just below the band.

Cold aroma of sour hay and milk chocolate.  Easy draw, wouldn't call it loose though

1st third is bitter and acrid like a combination of very burnt coffee with a splash of strong vinegar.  Medium body, the bitterness lingers in the mouth and actually stings the back of my mouth.   Bit of a wonky burn but it corrected.

2nd third - This isn't a cigar I want to savor but I'm taking my time to give it a chance.  At least the sour went away, this is all bitter now with an aftertaste of pure ash.  I'm gonna need a gargle after this one is done.

Final - I don't know if this bitter pill got more mild or if my mouth is just getting used to it but that burnt bitterness eased back a little.  No pleasant flavors added though.  The cigar did burn fine throughout.  80 minutes without coming close to nubbing it.

Back in 30 days

[Doctortrent]

Received This box March 24th

these have a dark chocolate wrapper with Nice oily sheen, cocoa and chocolate

Construction is fantastic thin wrapper

first third started a little bitter with a nice cocoa flavor mild body

second third 

Nice amounts of cocoa and cream

last third all mongrel 

very nice chocolate flavors 

with a litter pepper  full body

REG September 19

 

 

[stevo]

My box of RyJ’s arrived on Monday 23rd March. First thing I noticed was how tightly they were packed in the box. Never had any sticks like this - almost too long for the box! There was a slight sheen to the cigars and a mild aroma. 

 

Box code:

MSA Oct 19

 

The first chance I had to sample one was two days ago, outside in a cold easterly wind. Sky was as clear as can be, sun beaming but no warmth. What I really noticed though was how eerily quiet it was, with everyone inside trying to avoid Covid-19. 

 

Cold aroma:

Very little to report here. The obvious tobacco smell but no real distinguishable aromas. The same on the unlit draw, just a tobacco taste with perhaps a tiny hint of a fruit.

 

First third:

The first real flavour was that of salt, although it did not last long. On the retro hale there was definitely a hint of leather.  Other than that, the odd cedar and fruit taste but sporadic and light.

 

Second third:

Bitterness came in and didn't really leave.  Ammonia throughout.  At one point the wind ashed the stick for me and for a few minutes after this the cigar smoothed out a little. Just when I hoped it had turned a corner, back came the ammonia.  It got so strong that at one point I almost had to give it up........almost.

 

Final third:

Same as the middle getting progressively stronger.  As I neared the golden band I had to let it go.  

 

The construction and draw were near-faultless throughout.  Looking forward to trying the next one!

 

Score: 86

 

Steve

 

 

 

[khenry0105]

Romeo y Julieta Churchills 

MSA OCT 19

Box arrived 3.27

First cigar smoked 3.29

• Prelight 
  • Beautiful wrapper
  • Nice light sheen
  • Excellent construction
  • Snug draw
• 1st Third
  • Draw starts a little tight, but opens up quickly
  • Perfect burn
  • Hay, tobacco and light cherry
  • No harshness of youth so far
• 2nd Third
  • Burn and draw are still perfect
  • Same flavor profile
  • Getting stronger
  • Still no harshness
• Final Third
  • Burn got out of whack, but actually self corrected without touch-up
  • Harshness setting in
  • Cherry gone completely 
  • Wrapper started cracking at the end
• Score: 90

 

[CigarZen]

Monte 2

REG SEP 19

The box arrived Day before yesterday but my building is now quarantining all packages for at least 24 hours.  It arrived at my door this AM, no more contact with door person for social distancing.  Sigh.

Pre-light:  A very nice box with medium chocolate colored wrappers showing a slight oily sheen.  The smell is glorious.  To the touch slightly more humidified than I maintain my cigars, which is wise for shipping purposes.

 

First Third: It with a slightly restrained draw but opened up quickly and burned very well, in fact throughout the cigar.  Body was under medium.  Think mouth feel of milk versus cream, which the latter I would call full bodied.  Tobacco is high quality but young.  Flavor had a distinct herbal note, something like mint, that predominated the profile; interesting and enjoyable.  There wasn’t any earth, coffee, or heft some Monte 2s have.  Amount of flavor was medium plus, no searching for it, delivered it clear as a bell. At this point I would score it 89/90.

Second Third: it picked up in strength but body remained under medium.  The mint-like profile persisted.  Mint is an inaccurate description but closest I can come.  Not as narrow or clean as mint, a bit broader, if you will.  The flavor resonated mostly at the tip of my tongue.  

At this age it’s not complex. It’s a one trick pony.

Final third:  It got wonky.  A sourness overtook the pleasant herbal profile.  No harshness, though.  Smoked it to the band but got no better.

Summary:  Promising longer term aging. Great smell, sheen, and intriguing flavors.  I am looking forward to revisiting in 30 days.  For now, into the 65% RH coolidor. 

Score: 87/88

[havanaclub]

These were psp/hq mix boxes of I am not mistaken? That correct?


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[El Presidente]

3 minutes ago, havanaclub said:

These were psp/hq mix boxes of I am not mistaken? That correct?


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Correct. 

 

The purpose of this is to show the evolution of cigars over a 60 day period from the time of arrival.  

 

[havanaclub]

Correct. 
 
The purpose of this is to show the evolution of cigars over a 60 day period from the time of arrival.  
 

Yes I am watching closely, think this is a great idea. Now I wish I grabbed a box of Churchills that day.


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[dobbs]

On 3/29/2020 at 2:28 PM, CigarZen said:

Flavor had a distinct herbal note, something like mint, that predominated the profile; interesting and enjoyable.

Mint is an inaccurate description but closest I can come.  Not as narrow or clean as mint, a bit broader, if you will.  The flavor resonated mostly at the tip of my tongue.

not to derail the thread, but i know exactly what you mean by the "mint" note. i experienced it in the only monte especial #2 i've smoked. it was very intriguing, bought a box, we'll see if i find it again.

-dobbs

[Reverb]

Received 3/30/20

Smoked 4/4/20

 

After my poor Monte experience I waited 5 days to smoke the Romeo Churchill.  There is a nice glistening sheen on the wrapper.  Love the size, I smoke a lot of churchills.

 

1st third

Firm draw, first two inches was packed a bit much.  Got a strong burnt cherry flavor at first puff. Then I got mineral flavors, graphite and pencil lead. The aftertaste was a wet grass taste and a lingering earthy mulchy flavor.  Not enjoying this at all.  Burnt plastic, toasted grassy weeds. The cigar had a wonky burn but didn't really need to touch it up.  The cigar was wet and young and continued with a more chemical aftertaste and a dusty dirty burn on the back of the throat.

 

2nd third

Didn't make it that far.

[Chibearsv]

30 Days from receipt.  TPO MAR 19

Box photo today - Some of these seem to be getting an oily look to them and they aren't nearly as bumpy.  I'm going to sample the one with the small crack in the foot

Cold aroma same as before - sour hay and milk chocolate.  Perfect draw now with slight resistance

1st third is very nice creamy sweet wet straw, white pepper, and milk chocolate.  Light to medium in body and taste.

Middle third picks up in strength and pepper gains a little more power here as well.  Not as sweet, very slightly bitter and milk chocolate is still present.  Only a touchup needed to correct the burn.

Final third the bitterness increases and the chocolate and sweetness fade.  Last bit was bitter harsh but nearly nubbed it.

Overall, a very pleasant improvement since the first try 30 days ago.

 

[Doctortrent]

30 days  

Monte no 2

Reg September 19

 

Box has a heavy chocolate smell

 

Draw is very tight 

 I Had to perfect draw it 

Opened up nicely after one 

poke

Lots of chocolate on the start up 

With a little bitterness  

A good amount of smoke as I draw 

Medium to full body

There is a very nice roasted tobacco

Flavor coming through with a little cocoa and cream on the second 3rd. That bitterness is slowly melting away

Last 3rd very Similar to the 2nd 

Not much evolution 

Very solid 89

 

 

[Wookie]

RyJ Churchill MSA OCT 19 - 30 Day Review

Nice Colorado Rosado sheen.  No sunshine today so I couldn’t get the identical box pic from 30 days ago.

1/3 Light/med body start with a good dollop of cherry and subtle woodsiness.

2/3 Body develops closer to medium…flavors hanging in there beautifully

3/3 Body becomes solid medium and cigar develops some edginess, perhaps showing its youth.  Flavors are still excellent. I will admit that I like cigars young and old.  Flavor is most important to me and I find 2018 and 2019 RyJ boxes have been uniformly excellent, while my 2015s are devoid of flavor. (My 2015 Wide Churchills also are bad, while the 2019 WCs are delicious.) It seems clear to me that RyJ Churchill is making a comeback in recent vintages and today’s smoke is no exception.  I am not sure I detect any major difference in flavor/body etc. after a 30 day rest.  90 points.

 

[Reverb]

I smoked my second Monte 2 at 30 days on 4/25/20

 

Not surprisingly, the cigar still has a beautiful rich dark color, some nice sheen, good weight, and a good draw, just a touch tight.   Upon lighting I found a definite improvement from day 1 ROTT.

 

1st third

All cocoa.  No mongrel. Milk chocolate on the retrohale.  Black currant, raisin. Touch of caramel. No bad aftertaste.

 

2nd third

Still lots of cocoa now with some clove.  Some mineral and plant flavor coming through though, losing the chocolate but getting some nut flavors.

 

3rd third

Cocoa still there, but getting some unpleasant citrus and wood. A touch of mongrel aftertaste at the end, but made it almost all the way through!

 

Huge improvement over the first one. I give it an 87  (the first one ROTT a 70)

[khenry0105]

Romeo y Julieta Churchills 

MSA OCT 19

Box arrived 3.27

Second cigar smoked 4.27

• Prelight:  light sheen; excellent construction; perfect draw
• 1st Third:  perfect burn; nice draw; light cherry, wood and tobacco flavors; just under medium; no harshness
• 2nd Third:  burn and draw remain perfect; cherry has almost disappeared and mainly wood and tobacco flavors now; solid medium; no harshness
• Final Third:  burn and draw continue to be flawless to the end; construction was impeccable; cherry has completely disappeared now; over medium; harshness appears at this point
• Overall:  very similar to the first example; solid construction, burn and draw
• Score: 90

[CigarZen]

30 DAY REVIEW 

Monte 2 - REG SEP 19

Pre-light impressions: after a 30 day stable environment the wrappers are oilier with the same darker chocolate colored wrapper, Colorado Maduro plus. Look nice.  Aroma, strong barnyard. 

The draw is easier than on arrival; it’s near perfect.

 

First third: It opens with a smooth heft and progresses to that ‘Monte twang’, delicious.  Dark chocolate darts in and fades. There are no herbal flavors that predominated the first smoke.  It’s now heartier.  A wood comes in, then a few puffs later, a sweeter wood, then back to a heartier rich wood.  It is showing much more complexity and is much stronger.

Second third: The wood fades and a meaty flavor appears, like a good cut of beef. Yum!  This is definitely a stronger smoke.  I guess this is a heavy ligero blend compared to earlier box codes. As you smoke it the ligero keeps building.

Last Third would be described as balls to the wall, strong.  The ligero completely masks the earlier flavors and complexity.  It’s an arse kicker. 

19 Monte 2s definitely have an extra margin of ligero, imo.

SCORE: 91

[Reverb]

May 5

 

What a difference 30 days makes. More beautiful sheen on the wrapper. Perfect draw.

 

1st third

Cherry, some light floral, beautiful burn, strong ash. Medium body, fresh bread and cookie lingering after taste, really enjoying this. No nasty flavors.

 

2nd third

Cherry, bread, cookies, especially on the retrohale, rich thick smoke.

 

3rd third

Very consistent, warm cookie and bread flavors, cherry. Slight citrus and mint towards the end.

 

Nubbed it. 91 (first one <70)

[dobbs]

i'm really enjoying this thread. i've definitely had boxes get shinier and better-looking with down-time. and there's no arguing that flavor improves immensely starting with 30 days minimum, but i am fully on the "wait 90 days" bandwagon now. it was suggested, but i wouldn't believe it without learning through experience.

wish i would have jumped on these boxes so i could participate, will have to enjoy vicariously instead. thanks all.

-dobbs

[Doctortrent]

60 days  

Monte no 2

Reg September 19

 

Dark chocolate 

Oily wrapper

Cocoa, chocolate sweetness 

 

Pre draw  perfection

 

This is the final smoke in our study

 

This box has definitely lost its new car smell, it has mellowed significantly

 

First third

 Little pepper on the first few puffs

Hint of cocoa and chocolate ash is 

pure white 

 

Second third

Very heavy smoke on all puffs

Construction is great,burn is perfect

Flavors have not changed much 

 

Final

Very smooth no edges 

Big hits of chocolate have now arrived

Very enjoyable 

 

 

Over the course of the experiment 

The most noticeable difference to me is the aroma at cold

Very fresh pungent chocolate to a much more mild smooth cocoa

The cigar over 60 days does not seem like the flavor or complexity has evolved much

Nice cigar but more rest needed
 

boxes below in order 

Arrival

30

60 days

Thanks FOH!

Its been fun being involved 

How bout we pull these out at 120 days and reflect one last time!! I would love to see if the flavor profile develops 

 

[Chibearsv]

Ok, it's day 60 for my box of Monte #2 TPO MAR 19

Cigars look great now in the box with sheen and very little bumpiness. Box aroma is the same since the start of this experiment - lovely aroma of milk chocolate and straw (not as sour now though)

Clip the end, lovely cold aroma of chocolate and straw.  Draw is perfect for me with light/medium resistance.  1st third is sweet milk chocolate and vanilla, medium body.

2nd 3rd swings into more barnyard twang with the sweetness and chocolate going to the background.  Burning perfectly

Final third transitions again to a more earthy forest floor taste and very slight pepper.

No retouches or re-lights.  Smoked it down to the nub and loved it.  I wasn't expecting this cigar to be so Monte 2 but it was exactly what I would be looking for.  Solid A - delicious.  I never expected the change from ROTT to now to be as drastic as it was for this box.  You pondering that perhaps I just picked a gem for this last smoke?  Maybe, but this experiment has made a believer out of me.