Winedor help..

[LandCruiser]

Okay guys, so, I know this gets gone over a million times. But every situation is a bit different. 

I have a dual zone wineador setup, and just now got the cooling system recharged and running. The max temp is 64 degrees Fahrenheit. For humidity control, I am using 2 1/2 lb bags of 65% heartfelt beads. 

For the last 2 weeks, humidity has been at a steady 64-65% with temps ranging from 68-74 degrees depending on how hot it is in the house. 

Now, tonight with it plugged it we have a different story. Set at 64 degrees (max temp) humidity is reading all the way up to 77% and temps between 62-64 degrees. 

Obviously, cool moist air is being pumped in when its running.... but this seems like way too high a spike to safely store CCs. My Xicar hygro reads the spike, showing 77%, while the spike is so fast that my Acurite is sitting at 69% over the past 2 hours. 

I dont think the humid beads can correct fast enough, and if its spiking every 1-2 hours or so your average would still be low 70% mark. 

Wineador experts.... help a brother out.... do I just unplug and roll with it or what? 

[LandCruiser]

It looks like every 30 minutes or so the fan only is kicking on also, which probably pumps fresh air in from the outside. During this last time the RH dropped to 51%, and has now rebounded to 68% after 15 mins.... 

Basically, this thing is all over the map.... anyone with a dual zone setup like this, please feel free to chime in. 

 

 

[MaxG]

What's your ambient room temp / rh?   Also looks like you've got a lot of empty space in there.  Those are monster swings though. 

 

- MG 

 

[LandCruiser]

24 minutes ago, MaxG said:

What's your ambient room temp / rh?   Also looks like you've got a lot of empty space in there.  Those are monster swings though. 

 

- MG 

 

Ambient room temp right now is mid 70s, but I have the windows open so its cooling a bit... we have had an unusually hot fall here in Arkansas. But it should be settling in the high 60s mid 70s outside here this week. 

There is some room, but it is a dual zone, so the its split there at the doors. I just have 5 boxes in there at the moment as a test run using 1lb of 65% beads. 

I went ahead and unplugged it until I can get this figured out. Its settled back down to 64% at 70 deg 

[LandCruiser]

Going to bump this once - otherwise I will just keep it unplugged indefinitely and roll with it 

[Hurltim]

do you know what your ambient rH is right now?

[BarryNY]

Try loading that cigar space up with more boxes...even empty wooden cigar boxes you can get from a local B&M.

Also - get 2 of those inexpensive spanish cedar trays at $15/each off the internet to help equalize things.

I'm sure our winedor resident expert will chime in to help....

[PigFish]

... does this run a compressor cooler, or one or two TE coolers?

In a nutshell, you have a system that must be driven by higher ambients or it does not dehydrate! I have written about this extensively and I am not really in the mood to write about it again. You can search various terms and see if you can find some answers that I have given in the past, you have a plethora of the same problems as others.

If you find yourself not understanding after the search, and if I have time I will discuss your case individually as well, yet again! Look first though please. I have some recent humidor orders and I am a bit back of book today!

Cheers! -the Pig

[LandCruiser]

5 minutes ago, PigFish said:

... does this run a compressor cooler, or one or two TE coolers?

In a nutshell, you have a system that must be driven by higher ambients or it does not dehydrate! I have written about this extensively and I am not really in the mood to write about it again. You can search various terms and see if you can find some answers that I have given in the past, you have a plethora of the same problems as others.

If you find yourself not understanding after the search, and if I have time I will discuss your case individually as well, yet again! Look first though please. I have some recent humidor orders and I am a bit back of book today!

Cheers! -the Pig

This one runs a compressor, wanted TE obviously, but picked this thing up off CraigsList for under $100 

I will try to dig up some stuff, but Im leaning towards just staying unplugged as others have done and not even jacking with it.

10 minutes ago, BarryNY said:

Try loading that cigar space up with more boxes...even empty wooden cigar boxes you can get from a local B&M.

Also - get 2 of those inexpensive spanish cedar trays at $15/each off the internet to help equalize things.

I'm sure our winedor resident expert will chime in to help....

Thanks, Im in the process of going the cedar drawer / tray route, just need a free weekend to knock them out. 

[Philc2001]

The RH fluctuations are not uncommon with active winedors. As the interior cools down the dew point will fall so your RH will react. How it reacts depends on the type of fridge. On some the back wall has a metal plate ahead of it with the coolant circulating through it (that's how my Haier is). In this type of fridge the humidity has a tendency to freeze on the metal surface whenever the compressor runs, and then the ice melts and drips into the drain and out into the drip tray. This has a tendency to continually remove humidity from the interior and it is not an ideal design for a winedor. Other models may be designed differently, so results will vary, but generally when temperature drops the dew point changes so your RH may climb inside the cooler unless there is something removing or equalizing the amount of humidity in the interior. 

I don't have any experience with the dual zone setups, but you may have another area you need to investigate further. I would assume there is some amount of air exchange between the two zones, probably controlled by a duct with a baffle inside it to limit the flow of air between the two sides. This may be robbing RH from one side and giving it to the other. 

 

[LandCruiser]

3 minutes ago, Philc2001 said:

The RH fluctuations are not uncommon with active winedors. As the interior cools down the dew point will fall so your RH will react. How it reacts depends on the type of fridge. On some the back wall has a metal plate ahead of it with the coolant circulating through it (that's how my Haier is). In this type of fridge the humidity has a tendency to freeze on the metal surface whenever the compressor runs, and then the ice melts and drips into the drain and out into the drip tray. This has a tendency to continually remove humidity from the interior and it is not an ideal design for a winedor. Other models may be designed differently, so results will vary, but generally when temperature drops the dew point changes so your RH may climb inside the cooler unless there is something removing or equalizing the amount of humidity in the interior. 

I don't have any experience with the dual zone setups, but you may have another area you need to investigate further. I would assume there is some amount of air exchange between the two zones, probably controlled by a duct with a baffle inside it to limit the flow of air between the two sides. This may be robbing RH from one side and giving it to the other. 

 

Each side appears to be sealed off entirely from the other, and has its own controls for temp. IE: Storing white wine in one side and red in the other at much different temps 

I assumed there would be a bit of fluctuation, but with the numbers varying as much as they did while it was plugged in last night, it seems completely useless as a humidor. +/- 20% RH is obviously not going to work when its hourly swings. 

 

25 minutes ago, Hurltim said:

do you know what your ambient rH is right now?

Ambient RH in the room looks to be at 50% sitting at 69 deg F 

[Philc2001]

30 minutes ago, LandCruiser said:

Each side appears to be sealed off entirely from the other, and has its own controls for temp. IE: Storing white wine in one side and red in the other at much different temps 

You may be right, but it might not be obvious, so you may want to poke around and see how the red wine side is cooled. I doubt that they have two separate cooling elements, but I suppose it is possible. In most side by side fridges, for example, the freezer contains the cooling element, and then cool air from the freezer is used to cool the fridge, but the ductwork between the two compartments is usually concealed in the back or in the walls.  

In either case, one of the things you can do is to use RH beads and add as much open grain cedar (either cedar boxes, cedar liners, etc. ) as you can to help stabilize the RH. A fan may also help a little to equalize the RH. However, there is no way that I know to eliminate the fluctuations in RH especially with compressor type coolers, all you can do is try to minimize the rise and fall in RH and aim for an acceptable average. If there is a cooling element in the cigar compartment, then try to see if it is condensing between cycles. If there is dew on the surface of the cooling element then it is a good bet that the humidity is being removed from the interior and converted to water and then draining out. If that is the case, and if you are a good handyman, you may be able to fabricate a vapor barrier between the cooling element and the interior to minimize the RH robbing effects, but it may be more work than it is worth.  

[Hurltim]

So if your ambient rH is lower than what is in the cooler I think it is safe to say that the cooler is somehow adding water to the air in the cooler. Compressor driven cooling should remove water during the cooling cycle. I am not familiar with this model but I would check the drip tray and see if it is full. If the fan continues to draw air over the drip tray, it will add water to the system. 

Just spit-balling. I couldn't find a good pic of it via google.

 

[LandCruiser]

17 minutes ago, Philc2001 said:

You may be right, but it might not be obvious, so you may want to poke around and see how the red wine side is cooled. I doubt that they have two separate cooling elements, but I suppose it is possible. In most side by side fridges, for example, the freezer contains the cooling element, and then cool air from the freezer is used to cool the fridge, but the ductwork between the two compartments is usually concealed in the back or in the walls.  

In either case, one of the things you can do is to use RH beads and add as much open grain cedar (either cedar boxes, cedar liners, etc. ) as you can to help stabilize the RH. A fan may also help a little to equalize the RH. However, there is no way that I know to eliminate the fluctuations in RH especially with compressor type coolers, all you can do is try to minimize the rise and fall in RH and aim for an acceptable average. If there is a cooling element in the cigar compartment, then try to see if it is condensing between cycles. If there is dew on the surface of the cooling element then it is a good bet that the humidity is being removed from the interior and converted to water and then draining out. If that is the case, and if you are a good handyman, you may be able to fabricate a vapor barrier between the cooling element and the interior to minimize the RH robbing effects, but it may be more work than it is worth.  

Okay sounds good, I think what I will do then is get these cedar drawers finished up as quick as possible and re-assess the situation then. With winter coming I wont need cooling as it will prob be mid- high 60s in the house on most days so that gives me a bit of time to tinker. I know there is only one compressor, etc for the unit, but I am not exactly sure how it works. 

16 minutes ago, Hurltim said:

So if your ambient rH is lower than what is in the cooler I think it is safe to say that the cooler is somehow adding water to the air in the cooler. Compressor driven cooling should remove water during the cooling cycle. I am not familiar with this model but I would check the drip tray and see if it is full. If the fan continues to draw air over the drip tray, it will add water to the system. 

Just spit-balling. I couldn't find a good pic of it via google.

 

Thanks TIm, Im going to check that when I get back to the house tonight also. 

For now, just happy its off and sitting at a nice a calm 64% RH and 67 Deg F hahaha (why mess with something that works without being turned on) right?