Soapy taste

[cottierm]

When smoking some recently produced cigars I have sometimes experienced a taste which I and other people have qualified as a “soapy” taste (probably similar to the “Sprite-like” taste described by other fellow smokers). As an example I can remember this taste associated with several Upmann PCs from a recent box. I am wondering if any of you has or can come with a better qualifier/descriptor for this kind of taste?

Best,

Michel

[Hohenthal]

A box of 2010 RASCC comes to mind which I found very soapy,

interestingly not so much fresh but after about 2 years

and the soapyness never went away (which of course I would have preferred).

I remember an older post where some members described this as a symptom for rushed (by pressure and temperature) fermentation of the tobacco leaves.

Partagas factory was quoted as a frequent perpetrator.

Upmann now is a bit worrying to me

Alex

[cottierm]

Does this augur badly for my box of Upmann PCs in the long term, Alex?

[Hohenthal]

Only time will tell, fingers crossed.

[Smallclub]

Concerning the Upmann pc, it's the typical vegetal taste that is often present in certain young Upmann's. The Super Corona had it (often), the Monarch had it (sometimes), the Gran corona/Amatistas had it (aggressively); even very young Sir Winston could have it (if you were unlucky).

I love the Upmann half corona precisely because even fresh it doesn't have a trace of that taste…

[cottierm]

Thanks for the precise and detailed info Frank!

Best,

Michel

[KoreanCowboy]

I've experienced the SOAP in a few cigars too. I always try and think of it as a clean taste rather than soap. I guess just to try and fool myself into thinking it's not a bad flavor. It's not the most pleasant flavor but I don't experience it too often so I don't generally worry about it.

[cigaraholic]

I've always thought that soapy taste comes from soap........aka... the washroom.

[Habana Mike]

C&P from my post on another board:

Recently smoked a Ramon Allones Portuguese RE 2010 that was totally soapy.

First Lusitanos out of the box had soap on the cold draw and throughout the first 2/3 of the cigar. Almost put it down but gave it a chance to the end where it redeemed itself a little.

Apparently I wasn't the only one that got that with this particular cigar:

Tried another a couple weeks later and it was fine, really good actually.

So it seems from some cursory research I've done that certain naturally occurring phenols in tobacco, particularly carbolic acid, can have a decided influence on the potential for a soapy taste to be detected.

Carbolic acid is used in many soaps http://en.wikipedia....i/Carbolic_soap

Considering further, Beta Damascenone is a rose ketone present in tobacco that contributes to honey, plum, tobacco (?!?), and black currant nuances along with megastigmatrienones which also introduce sweet tobacco, honeyed and dried (stewed) fruit flavors to our cigars.

Other interesting carotenoid derivatives found in cured tobacco are theaspirone, an ingredient in black tea and a component of tea essential oil, and beta-cyclocitral, which is described as green, grassy or hay-like. Must be the prevalent compounds in Cohibas...

In addition I found that apparently many of the flavors and aromas such as woody, vanilla, anise, clove, nutmeg, cinammon and basil/vegetal along with the occasional 'whiff of a Sharpie marker' can all be attributed to these same phenolshttp://cigarfan.net/.../cigar-science/

For the truly interested or ambitious student, extensive detail on the chemical compounds in various tobaccos and results from burning can be found in this 56 page dissertation:

http://www.leffingwe...._chemistry.pdf

Of course some individuals are more prone than others in detecting the particular chemical compounds that contribute to the flavors or sensations found while enjoying a particular cigar, and this certainly gives merit to the duration and conditions surrounding the aging of cigars as the chemical compounds change over time.

To quote Tom (cigarfan), author of the initial reference, "Many cigar enthusiasts have detected flavors like these at one point or another. Floral, honey and tea-like notes I find most often in milder cigars, usually with shade wrappers. And while these are just a few of the elements from only one group of the many compounds that contribute to the flavor and aroma of cigar tobacco, I hope it shows that notes of tea or grass or violet are not out of the range of possibility for some experienced cigar enthusiasts.

So if you find yourself musing over the soft wood and floral notes of that ’02 Choix Supreme and suddenly detect a hint of honey, consider yourself fortunate… not crazy."

On another note, cilantro has also been described as having a soapy taste. Apparently it is aldehydes that cause the soapy sensation in cilantro/coriander. Interstingly, aldehydes are also present in tobacco. Things that make you say Hmmm.....

[Laxman]

Funny as was recently smoking a SLR series A single I got and was thinking, damn this tastes like soap. End up tossing it halfway through. Will have to revisit down the road as I love the remaining SLR's.

[Cisco]

I have tasted this flavour before in CCs and I remember searching to see if others have detected this flavour as well. I recall reading a posting where someone speculated that the cigar roller must of had soap residue on his\her hands.

To me, this flavour has to be a flaw of some type, as I have picked it up on occasion and it ruins the cigar experience. The "rapid fermentation" theory sounds interesting...I wonder why this has not been discussed more? Perhaps it's like TCA in wine; some people cannot detect it while others are very sensitive to it.

[Smallclub]

...I wonder why this has not been discussed more?

It has been discussed ad nauseam on every cigar board since the 90's… a time during which I doubt that torcedors had access to soap, btw…

[El Presidente]

I've always thought that soapy taste comes from soap........aka... the washroom.

Tongue in cheek......that would be the first thing stolen every day

[BonVivant]

Did anyone experience a soapy taste in Cohiba, Montecristo or Trinidad Robusto T?

[cottierm]

@ Bon Vivant

Not me so far.

[Habanos2000]

I've experienced a clearly soapy taste in several, but not all, Punch PC's from one particular box. The cigars started out wonderfully and then about halfway into it turned exceptionally soapy, to the point that they weren't smokeable. At first I thought it was just me, but after it happened the 2nd and 3rd times I really became weary of smoking any more of them. I think I have at least 10 left. This had nothing to do with young cigars as these are at least 4 years old. I'd sure like to know what's causing this flavor.

[Rogers72]

I've never gotten a soapy taste but I did have 5pk Sampler of a Regional Release that tasted very strongly of women's perfume/hand cream. All 5 of them. This was from a release about 5 years ago. I wrote it off as either someone in the factory or at the retailer was using something of the sort while handling the cigars. Fine either way...I still enjoyed them.

[Hubba]

One of the first Cohiba PE i smoked was a slightly soapy floral/perfume like. It was very much different than the rest of the box....although unique, it wasn't a cigar I smoked past the half way point.

[contracorrientes]

On a similar-but-different note, I occasionally experience what I can only describe as a "fried chicken" taste. Only ever in the, say, final third or so. And unlike actual fried chicken, it's somewhat undelicious.

[kjellfrick]

Leo, a good friend of mine had an entire box of Siglo I that tasted very soapy. As I remember he threw away most of the cigars.

[poisonowns]

The fried chicken tasting cigar has me intrigued. I'm on the hunt for a cigar with an applewood bacon finish.

[contracorrientes]

The fried chicken tasting cigar has me intrigued. I'm on the hunt for a cigar with an applewood bacon finish.

Now that I think about it, maybe it was a KFC drumstick...

[ewipper]

Frank is the most knowledgeable as to the cause of soapiness in cigars. I would defer to his expertise. Anyone ever taste insecticide?

[mbrody]

I have a box of Unicos that taste soapy…have me gun shy from getting them again.

[Li Bai]

On 1/22/2014 at 9:46 AM, Habana Mike said:

On another note, cilantro has also been described as having a soapy taste. Apparently it is aldehydes that cause the soapy sensation in cilantro/coriander. Interstingly, aldehydes are also present in tobacco.

Interesting topic... I've never tasted soapiness in cigars but I definitely can in cilantro.

Studies have found that 17% of Europeans share a mutation on a gene (OR6A2 for those interested) that leads to the overexpression of a certain protein inducing that strong soapy taste when eating coriander...3% for the Middle-East, 7% for South East Asia and 14% for Africa.

Do you people who experience that soapy taste in cigars also experience it when eating cilantro? I know it's an old topic but I'm interested in your answers 👍