Why do Cuban cigars need lower humidity?

[David67]

Just thought I'd as people for their theories on this interesting subject.

Why do Cuban cigars keep best at 65% humidity and non-Cuban cigars are keep best at 70%?

My own theory is that Cuban cigars wrappers seem to be more delicate and non-Cuban smokes seem to have stiffer thicker wrappers and this is part of the reason.

Others thoughts.......?

[capnshazam]

I personally like all my cigars at 65

[Upmann2009]

HSA recommend 65-70%?

I find it burn better and consistent @ 65%

@ 70% it die out often and ruin your experience and the smoke is just to thick and strong

[mk05]

Why do Cuban cigars keep best at 65% humidity...

They do?

[Stiks]

I like all my smokes around 65%

[Guybrush]

Most people I know store and smoke Cuban cigars at 70%.

But that's Europe.

[canadianbeaver]

When I got a digital hydrometer for wine fridge and coolidor, I saw that 62-66 seemed be the #'s. When the humidity/temp went higher, the cigars seemed to go out more during smoking and have a more bitter taste sometimes? Someone else might need to confirm this. I might be full of BS.

[Colt45]

Others thoughts.......?

That this is one of those "old wive's tales" , like 70/70 - it gets tossed around long enough, it becomes "fact".....

I agree with a number of already mentioned thoughts - generally speaking, Cuban cigars tend to be rolled tighter than those from other regions. Lower humidity can help improve draw and burn for a tightly rolled cigar, but probably won't help one which is truly poorly rolled. Flavor as well - a "damp" cigar will tend to be more "funky, bitter", though one which is loosely rolled can often be acrid.

As for wrappers. I don't feel it's really country of origin as much as priming, processing, etc. All purely subjective on my part.

[BMack]

I store and smoke all my Habanos and NCs at about 62% RH. There are a couple of cigars that seem to smoke better at around 68-70% RH but the mass majority start to taste muddy and have burn problems.

[stogieluver]

65 better than 70 for me.

[Wil]

Yep, less draw, burn and acridity issues for me at 65%

[mash]

Its all subjective and your own personal taste. Some prefer cigars in the low 70's while others prefer them in the low 60's. There really is no way of claiming one is the "right" way or "wrong" way.

You're missing the point.

Many experienced cigar smokers tend to prefer a lower humidity for their Cubans than for their non-Cubans. NC's smoke dry and hot at humidities that are optimal for Cubans, the low to mid 60's. I believe the question is why that is.

[finecigar]

I keep everything at 64-67% . That's the way I like it

[mk05]

Many experienced cigar smokers tend to prefer a lower humidity for their Cubans than for their non-Cubans. NC's smoke dry and hot at humidities that are optimal for Cubans, the low to mid 60's. I believe the question is why that is.

Would you say that these experienced smokers are from an era where cigars were rolled badly and needed to be aged in low humidity in order to draw? Would you say these cigars kept in lower humidity conditions don't taste as good as ones kept in higher temp/humidity? Would you consider the fact that most crossover smokers are leveraging their experiences on NCs - they smoke Padrons and have a set of expectations on what draws they are "supposed to prefer." I see people lopping off half a cigar on piramides/torpedoes. And how about the fact that LCDHs - at least the ones I know - keep the cigars at higher temp/humidity.

[mash]

Would you say that these experienced smokers are from an era where cigars were rolled badly and needed to be aged in low humidity in order to draw? Would you say these cigars kept in lower humidity conditions don't taste as good as ones kept in higher temp/humidity? Would you consider the fact that most crossover smokers are leveraging their experiences on NCs - they smoke Padrons and have a set of expectations on what draws they are "supposed to prefer." I see people lopping off half a cigar on piramides/torpedoes. And how about the fact that LCDHs - at least the ones I know - keep the cigars at higher temp/humidity.

My own experience is that Cubans tend to taste acrid, almost sour, at 70%. They don't draw as well either, as you say, the quality of the roll is not what a typical NC is.

If I smoke a Padron, Oliva, Illusione etc. that is kept in the mid to low 60's, I find it tastes too hot. Again, as you say, NC's are rolled well enough that they draw better at higher humidity. Some of the NC brands just stuff the tobacco in too, they are really dense. I know there are people that find Padrons have a loose draw, I think they're perfect at around 70.

I think the LCDH's, and some local shops where I live, overhumidify their cigars. Havana House in Canada does as well. Are they worried that as their humidors get opened frequently the cigars will dry out?

What do you do?

[mash]

And many experienced smokers (when does one become "experienced" by the way?) prefer higher humidity levels. You used the only word that really matters. Prefer. It is personal taste.

I prefer lower humidity in the 60-63 range. I am not able to tell the difference if a cigar is stored at 65 though. That certainly does not mean that it is needed for Cuban cigars however. The question is "why do CCs need lower RH? The answer is that they do not need anything that the smoker does not choose.

Have you ever smoked a freshly rolled cigar in Cuba? I mean not with a young box code but one that was rolled 7 seconds before you put fire to it? How high is the humidity in the cigar at that time? 80%? 85%?

Its all personal taste bro. No book, or "expert" or stranger on an internet forum has the right answer because of the subjecte aspect of taste.

Exactly. You're an experienced smoker. Why do you prefer that lower humidity range? You might not be able to tell the difference between 63 and 65%, but I bet you deliberately don't keep your Cubans at 70%. Why not? Do you keep your NC's at the same humidity,and if not, why? There is a trend that experienced smokers who have experimented at different humidities keep their Cubans drier. You see this on all the boards. What is it about Cuban tobacco that it prefers this environment? That's the question.

[mk05]

What do you do?

Hi mash, at one point, I used to believe the dogma that lower humidity was better for CCs. Then I had an epiphany.

One summer, I left a tubo of my RyJ Churchill in my car. It must have been about 95 degrees. I got back in my car, and the tubo was searing hot. I took that cigar out, and boy was it soft. Let me tell you though, the aroma emanating from that tubo was just devine - just like the LCDHs that keep the humidity up. Taste is 80% smell!

Well that cigar was the best cigar I had smoked until then. So I started to keep my cigars at an environment that was more like a south american atmosphere - without going too far. My humidor is around 75 degrees and 72%. I drybox if I know a certain cigar just tastes better without the moisture.

This is my personal preference. I like to smoke cigars *hot* as it elevates the flavors and aroma. If the cigars are ready (aged enough), then it'll smoke well. If it's too young, it'll be acrid.

Try it. Take a tubo and leave it in your car one summer. Smoke it on the drive back. I guarantee you that it will blow your mind.

[mash]

Hi mash, at one point, I used to believe the dogma that lower humidity was better for CCs. Then I had an epiphany.

One summer, I left a tubo of my RyJ Churchill in my car. It must have been about 95 degrees. I got back in my car, and the tubo was searing hot. I took that cigar out, and boy was it soft. Let me tell you though, the aroma emanating from that tubo was just devine - just like the LCDHs that keep the humidity up. Taste is 80% smell!

Well that cigar was the best cigar I had smoked until then. So I started to keep my cigars at an environment that was more like a south american atmosphere - without going too far. My humidor is around 75 degrees and 72%. I drybox if I know a certain cigar just tastes better without the moisture.

This is my personal preference. I like to smoke cigars *hot* as it elevates the flavors and aroma. If the cigars are ready (aged enough), then it'll smoke well. If it's too young, it'll be acrid.

Try it. Take a tubo and leave it in your car one summer. Smoke it on the drive back. I guarantee you that it will blow your mind.

That's very interesting. Wish there was enough heat where I live to test out that theory. I guess you freeze everything to avoid beetles? I'll try it in the summer, thanks for this.

[mk05]

The only positive "criticism" I have received on this was that my cigars may "mature" too quickly. Well I solved that by doing 2 things.

I bought a lot, and I vacuum packed what I wanted to keep - so the environment is the same, but the airflow is minimal.

[BonVivant]

Zino Davidoff explained the whole thing over fifty years ago, why argue?

Just have to mature your cigars in Cuba, accordingly.

[kodebusan]

I tend to "aged" my CC around 65% and smoked them around 70%. When smoked around 65%, i found the cigars to be more a bit aggressive and linear, losing sweetness for more spices/roasted flavor. Though some small ring gauge like LGC MdO #3 smoke better at 65 for me.

As for the NC i smoke them around 76% for the same reason.

I agree with Shlomo it is only a matter of taste and palate regarding culturally how your taste have been formed since your childhood. Anglo Saxons tend to prefer their smoke around around 65% while continental European generally smoke around 70%.

The only important thing is to keep your cigars in a good range of humidity for a good conservation all the rest is a matter of taste.

Here's an interresting interview of Teddy Lam

http://www.cgarsltd.co.uk/document.php?id=cigaradvisor.htm

[mash]

I tend to "aged" my CC around 65% and smoked them around 70%. When smoked around 65%, i found the cigars to be more a bit aggressive and linear, losing sweetness for more spices/roasted flavor. Though some small ring gauge like LGC MdO #3 smoke better at 65 for me.

As for the NC i smoke them around 76% for the same reason.

I agree with Shlomo it is only a matter of taste and palate regarding culturally how your taste have been formed since your childhood. Anglo Saxons tend to prefer their smoke around around 65% while continental European generally smoke around 70%.

The only important thing is to keep your cigars in a good range of humidity for a good conservation all the rest is a matter of taste.

Here's an interresting interview of Teddy Lam

http://www.cgarsltd....igaradvisor.htm

So do you change cultures when you go from smoking Cubans to non-Cubans, or is there another reason why you prefer to smoke Cubans drier?

No one's trying to tell anyone what to do. The point is, it's common for people to say that the optimal smoking humidity for Cubans is less than for non-Cubans. Why is that?

[Justmi]

Surely it doesn't matter whether it is stored at 65 or 70 if you dry-box your cigars before you smoke them.

[stargazer14]

In reference to the original question, I myself do find that NC's and Cubans react best at different humidity.

For me NC's need a higher percentage (75%?)to soften up a bit, most are hard dog turds to me and when they get

towards the dry side its like smoking the leg of a wooden chair, polyurethane and all.

Cubans on the other hand seem softer and not as hard as a rule, they just smoke better around 60-70% to me.

NOW all that said I am not one who believes in the strict 'cigars have to be kept at 65-70' mumbo - I see these smokes coming from a warm, humid island with many fluctuations in temp and environment and ITS JUST A LEAF.

So for longtime (10 years rest) storage, sure 65-65 is a great way to keep them safe, but other than that, even tho my humidor is stable and secure, cigars can take a beating as long as you are not going to smoke them at a time they are too dry or too wet.

MK05 is right, cigars can perform after some radical trips with some interesting results.

[PigFish]

Hi mash, at one point, I used to believe the dogma that lower humidity was better for CCs. Then I had an epiphany.

One summer, I left a tubo of my RyJ Churchill in my car. It must have been about 95 degrees. I got back in my car, and the tubo was searing hot. I took that cigar out, and boy was it soft. Let me tell you though, the aroma emanating from that tubo was just devine - just like the LCDHs that keep the humidity up. Taste is 80% smell!

Well that cigar was the best cigar I had smoked until then. So I started to keep my cigars at an environment that was more like a south american atmosphere - without going too far. My humidor is around 75 degrees and 72%. I drybox if I know a certain cigar just tastes better without the moisture.

This is my personal preference. I like to smoke cigars *hot* as it elevates the flavors and aroma. If the cigars are ready (aged enough), then it'll smoke well. If it's too young, it'll be acrid.

Try it. Take a tubo and leave it in your car one summer. Smoke it on the drive back. I guarantee you that it will blow your mind.

My friend, whether by accident or design, you have captured the essence of the debate in this and your other posts. I hope you don't mind me using them as an example.

rH alone means nothing! Please read that again so you (meaning all readers) understand it. rH, mentioned without a corresponding temperature is meaningless!!! I can prove this, or you can to yourself via a psychrometric chart of humidity.

I have a half written somewhat formal analysis on this that topic that I will post someday; not today unfortunately.

In essence you are not storing air in your humidor, you are storing cigars. Cigars conditioned by the very water vapor, not air, that exists in your humidor. Air is meaningless. Air is only a medium that assists in the transfer of heat and has noting to do with water content of your cigars!

Water vapor is the essence of the properly conditioned cigar. Water vapor content is not independent of, but linked to temperature. Water vapor is not the only variable. This is where most people get lost. Temperature is as important, or more so than water vapor itself. I can prove this, I just won't be doing it today!!

In order to understand, not utilize, but actually understand cigar storage you need to understand the hygroscopic nature of things. Tobacco is a hygroscopic "thing." Hygroscopicity is dependent on the physical nature of things. It is dependent on two equal parts. Those parts are temperature and humidity. The relationship is visualized by the isothermal chart of the "thing."

Water activity in all "things" are not equal or linear to the equilibrium vapor pressure of water. There are two, actually three including pressure, that affect water content. Temperature is as important, if not perhaps more important than rH.

While happy to share my opinion regarding the sweet spot for storing cigars, it is unimportant when contrasted to the information above. Storing cigars is easy. Understanding storing cigars is a lesson in science.

Happy smoking! -the Pig