Rare Cubans

[Colt45]

I readily admit that I've been quite intrigued by this whole thing, but nothing about it makes me feel good, and I've truly no desire to cast aspersions on

anyone involved. The possibility that higher ups in Habanos or Cubatabaco may have been in collusion only makes me feel worse, and casts further

doubt on my already shaky faith in Habanos as a corporate entity.

Thinking out loud, my thoughts are that these have a fairly good chance of being back door cigars. And while they may be very good, and even rolled with

very good tobacco, they could not be called legitimate Habanos - their only value being that they are cigars. Again, these are just my own thoughts. What

does make me feel good however, is that in the main, members here did not try and turn this into some kind of witch hunt - not that I'd personally expect

anything less. Hopefully the truth will come out in the end.

[compitaveggie]

I readily admit that I've been quite intrigued by this whole thing, but nothing about it makes me feel good, and I've truly no desire to cast aspersions on

anyone involved. The possibility that higher ups in Habanos or Cubatabaco may have been in collusion only makes me feel worse, and casts further

doubt on my already shaky faith in Habanos as a corporate entity.

Thinking out loud, my thoughts are that these have a fairly good chance of being back door cigars. And while they may be very good, and even rolled with

very good tobacco, they could not be called legitimate Habanos - their only value being that they are cigars. Again, these are just my own thoughts. What

does make me feel good however, is that in the main, members here did not try and turn this into some kind of witch hunt - not that I'd personally expect

anything less. Hopefully the truth will come out in the end.

Exactly what I was thinking Colt. Probably good cigars but can't be called Habanos.

Jose

[Van55]

Rumor is that there's plenty of buzz about this matter in Cuban cigar business circles. I believe that Adam will soon regret the day he decided to give puff dot com the exclusive video. I look forward to learning what Rob finds out, if anything.

[Jimmy2]

President Dmitry Medvedev meet with Raul and Fidel Castro on 28 November 2008 ....

Raul Castro was in Russia for i think 8 days on January 29 2009 to..

[cigarros]

President Dmitry Medvedev meet with Raul and Fidel Castro on 28 November 2008 ....

Raul Castro was in Russia for i think 8 days on January 29 2009 to..

Only they didn't receive as a present such cigars like shown Adam Collins on puff dot com - aka cubans aka russians fake "diplomatics" Palmas Real

Just have looked through СА forum. There "military operations" were developed there )) It's difficult for someone CA members believe that the FOH community has sources in Russia

Cheers!

[Jimmy2]

These are just cigars nothing more nothing less are they fake are they not who knows?

Were they given out were they not no one really knows except the people they were given to if real?

But in the end they are no differant from the cigars we all smoke here as they are ment to all go down in a blaze of glory..

The only thing differant from ours is a fancy box they come in ..

[Colt45]

Thinking about this earlier in the day.......

I'm an avid collector well connected with people within the Cuban cigar industry - do either of the following scenarios seem possible or probable:

1) I let it be known that I'm always on the lookout for the rare, unique, one-off, etc. My connection(s) just happen to be able to supply me with

what I'm looking for - meaning they have these cigars produced on the side for their own profit, telling me they are legitimate rarities.

2) I commission some rare one-offs from my connection(s), which never legitimately existed and were produced on the side, so that I may sell

them as rarities for my own profit.

Again, all hypothetical.

[Bartolomeo]

Seems lots of diff people have agendas posting on the CA thread

Jose summed it up best though

Bart

[Van55]

These are just cigars nothing more nothing less are they fake are they not who knows?

Were they given out were they not no one really knows except the people they were given to if real?

But in the end they are no differant from the cigars we all smoke here as they are ment to all go down in a blaze of glory..

The only thing differant from ours is a fancy box they come in ..

I have to disagree with you, Jimmy. There's another difference. Some people are paying a huge premium for cigars that are being misrepresented as "rarities" when, in reality, they are probably back door or counterfeit. The misrepresentations, to me, are a big deal to me and I think should be to the rest of the cigar smoking community.

[brutusthebuckeye]

[chrisguinther]

Here's the bottom line:

1. If these cigars are fake, then people have the right to know. With respect to the vendor's reputation, he should never display a product of questionable source for sale. If it's part of a private collection being displayed but not for sale, fine.

2. I don't have the money to buy a real Behike or a fake one, so for many smokers, I think it's a non-issue except if the vendor knowingly sells them (ie. knows they are fake), then they shouldn't buy anything from him ever.

3. I really don't understand the rationale of allowing puff dot com to have this video in the first place. To me that alone would put into question the vendor's intentions based on many comments about this board on other forums.

[Van55]

I'm topping this in hopes that Rob made some inquiries and gained some insights into the issues during his time at the Festival and will let us in on them.

[KB24]

I find it interesting that Rob, Smithy nor Ken has commented on this post.

-P

[Buch0]

I'm topping this in hopes that Rob made some inquiries and gained some insights into the issues during his time at the Festival and will let us in on them.

From what I have gathered Rob only involved himself in enquiring about the regular production behikes while in Havana, although I am looking forward to his insight about this particular matter.

[compitaveggie]

I'm not surprised that Rob hasn't said anything yet. He obviously has his own opinion but, he is also a business man and must know what getting accused of something like this can do to a persons business. It also could look like a conflict of interest if Rob came out and denounced every dealer that was accused to sell fakes. I have never met Rob but, he seems like a man of class and is probably holding out his opinion until he gets enough facts to go one way or the other. Who knows, he might not even state his opinion, he might just relay what he heard. The tricky part of this is that although Adam has been taking most of the crap, Jimmy has some similar cigars with bands that are similar as well(palma).

To call out one is to call out both.

This needs to be done carefully and I think Rob knows it.

I also cant wait to hear what he heard and hopefully he gives us his opinion as well.

Jose

[Van55]

Those of you who followed the since deleted thread at cA on which HH (Adam Collins) posted, will recall that he promised to return from the Habanos Festival and to provide "all the proof" we needed of the legitimacy of these cigars.

I wrote him an email yesterday regarding this promise and, since the cA thread had been deleted, offered him the opportunity to read the parallel thread at HCF and post his response to set the record straight. Below is his response to my email:

Van

Once again I must state that just because rare items are not known to the public it does not mean they don't exist.

There is no proof that I can provide to change the minds of those who are set in their opinions.

All the special productions were sold some time ago and all my clients are quite happy.

I will leave things like that.

I guess fooling some of the people all of the time is good enough for Adam and Havana Humidor in Nassau.

,

And yes, it appears that Jimmy Ng might be purveying the same bogus cigars, as is another well respected vendor in the UK.

[mrcoin]

Those of you who followed the since deleted thread at cA on which HH (Adam Collins) posted, will recall that he promised to return from the Habanos Festival and to provide "all the proof" we needed of the legitimacy of these cigars.

I wrote him an email yesterday regarding this promise and, since the cA thread had been deleted, offered him the opportunity to read the parallel thread at HCF and post his response to set the record straight. Below is his response to my email:

I guess fooling some of the people all of the time is good enough for Adam and Havana Humidor in Nassau.

,

And yes, it appears that Jimmy Ng might be purveying the same bogus cigars, as is another well respected vendor in the UK.

Well, there ya go. They are genuine because Adam Collins says they are genuine. That's all the proof ya need right? Never mind that the number sequence on the Befakees is incorrect. Never mind that those diplomatic bands don't exist and never mind what Cigaros told us about the Russian visit.

Looks like another seller of fakes has been outed. As he should be.

[ChanceSchmerr]

A famous quote by recently fired Toronto Blue Jays General Manager J.P. Ricciardi comes to mind........

"It's not a lie if we know the truth"

[Colt45]

Well, there ya go. They are genuine because Adam Collins says they are genuine.

Without irrefutable facts, neither side can really be believed - no matter how loud they cry. And while anecdotal evidence suggests things might

not be as they seem, one thing is for certain - none of us here are judge, jury, or executioner.

[Cohiba007]

I will be staying at the Atlantis March 18-21st. Hopefully Adam will be around.

[compitaveggie]

Without irrefutable facts, neither side can really be believed - no matter how loud they cry. And while anecdotal evidence suggests things might

not be as they seem, one thing is for certain - none of us here are judge, jury, or executioner.

I agree 100%

Discretion should be used in these sensitive matters.

Jose

[Colt45]

Discretion should be used in these sensitive matters.

Yes. On more than one occasion, Rob has mentioned Australia's strict libel laws - he gets left holding the bag. Aside from that, I have found the whole

thing very interesting. And while I have my thoughts, it doesn't matter what I think. And in this case, I wouldn't bet my family's lives on what I know.

[KB24]

We hear of stories about people purchasing cigars from a friend's relative's brother who works at a factory in Cuba. More often than not the results are fake cigars but when you think about, people are out there that actually have these connections and have the ability to get cigars other people might not access to. I once saw a youtube clip of a guy showing off all these pairs of Michael Jordan shoes that I had never seen before and that I know had never been released to the public. There were tons of comments about how they were fake and came from China or Japan and it wasn't until the same guy came forward in another video standing next to Michael's son Jeffrey, did people realize he had that connection to get "rare" Jordan shoes. I'm not sure my point but I guess it would be to not pass judgement because we just don't know who knows who and who has connections to where. Adam's cigars in the video might be questionable and his response didn't really help his cause but I'm sure somewhere someone else has these types of rare cigars that are probably "legit" but because no one else has seen or heard of them everyone else assumes they are fake. Just my opinion.

-Patrick

[mrcoin]

I will be staying at the Atlantis March 18-21st. Hopefully Adam will be around.

Please let us know your impressions when you return.

[thechenman]

I will be staying at the Atlantis March 18-21st. Hopefully Adam will be around.

Looks like I will be missing you by two weeks. I will be staying at Atlantis from April 7th to the 11th.